Spooks, over the 9 series has seen a lot of change in dynamics, mentality, and indeed characters.

But are there any particularly massive changes whether within the story or just about the show that jump out at you?

For me the biggest one is the change in their mentalities. I think a big reason behind the loss of Tom, Danny + Zoe is their lack of a "killer instinct".
But as time went on, Tom, Zoe + Danny left, Adam came in from MI6, as did Ros & Fiona, Zaf came in from wherever - Interestingly Jo was recruited by Adam despite them showing how people can simply apply to MI5 these days, which shows a bit of the old school still there.

But I think things were run differently at MI6, which caused MI5 to change with the personnel coming over.The team became more brutal and lethal, killing was a necessity of the job on a regular occasion and the death toll rapidly increased after Series 3. Harry was willing to sanction killings left right and centre, rather than just one or two during the first few series.

Just interesting to me how that changed, it was good timing though, as although it made the show slightly more mainstream, it did add a bit of grit without going over the top and becoming rubbish - but it also increased with the increased threats of terrorism to Britain so sometimes it was vital to prevent things from happening.


(Sorry if the Spoilers were unnecessary not 100% on what I should be spoilering)

You're right. I could sense a change sometime after series 3. It seemed more action-like and also more of the ends justify the means (as long as the greater good is achieved). There was some of that during the first three series, but afterward, there seemed to be a lot more.

Personally, I mostly liked the changes, although I enjoyed both styles. I also really like how they are willing to tackle so many different contemporary issues (Iran, Libya, etc) during the latter series.

I agree that it definitely became more action-packed and prone to using lethal force as the show has progressed. And in those earlier series not everything centred around London, which I miss. I personally hope that the earlier series are more like the 'real' spooks.

There have been two shifts for me.

The first was in S3 with the big cast changes that series. I actually really liked how they handled all of those. I underestimate S3, I think. Another reason for that shift was the Andrew Woodhead took over as Producer. His vision for the series is a bit different than what came before. However, for me, it primarily remained suspense based.

The next shift for came in S6. Andrew Woodhead was still Producer, but it felt like they decided to make the series slicker, less suspenseful and more action-based. If memory serves, S6 was when they changed the film stock they were using, which lent itself to that slicker and more action based mood. The camera work changed as well. It felt to me that they started using a lot more hand-held and less stationary and/or tracking shots. I am not a huge fan of this particular shift in either respect, but by the time they got to S7, it worked very well for me.

There was shift in S9 for me as well - due to new Producer and writers - but since there are those who have not seen it I will stop there. While it was not altogether successful for me - better than S6 though - I "get" what they were trying to do and like the idea of returning to a more suspense based mood; e.g. fewer explosions, more espionage. I hope S10 follows through on that idea.

(28-04-2011 01:31 PM)HellsBells Wrote:  I agree that it definitely became more action-packed and prone to using lethal force as the show has progressed. And in those earlier series not everything centred around London, which I miss. I personally hope that the earlier series are more like the 'real' spooks.

Yeah its gotten more into an action drama and somewhat away (though not completely) from focusing only on intelligence gathering and spying. I like it, but I think the style of the first three seasons was better and more like the 'real' spooks too. It felt somewhat more realistic.

Question for you and A Cousin- Do you think Andrew Woodhead was influenced by the rise of 24 and how it has a lot of action? I think that Spooks is better than 24 and more realistic than it, but the two of them (especially Spooks in the latter series) have a lot of action. Both of them are focused on counter-terrorism too (though I have to say that the enemies in Spooks are more wide ranging). There are also more moles and conspiracies in the latter seasons of Spooks (similar to 24).

That's interesting (S9 returning to more suspense and espionage, etc). I look forward to it...as long as my affiliate goes forward with it *crosses fingers*

I must admit that I only watched the first series of 24, and didn't like it, other than showing it in real time, I found it quite boring. I didn't think 24 was as well written as Spooks.
I don't think Andrew Woodhead would have been influenced by 24, I think it was more a move towards high-action because you can't just watch people sat at their desks gathering information for 9 series! It had to evolve, to continue for so long, and that would seem the obvious direction to take it.

Some great observations and I would add that the major difference for me is the move from personalisation of the characters. In seasons 1-5 there was a focus on the action, the espionage, the intelligence gathering and the PEOPLE behind that. Now, especially in S9, that is completely missing. We learned little about Beth and zero about Demitri. There are no personal scenes anymore and there is also little humour. Sadly lacking are the one liners and excellent sarcasm.

I also think they've lost the intelligence of Harry and Ruth with the new writers and reference to philosophers and literature.

The world is now sadly all about explosions and guns.

(29-04-2011 06:16 PM)loladom Wrote:  Some great observations and I would add that the major difference for me is the move from personalisation of the characters. In seasons 1-5 there was a focus on the action, the espionage, the intelligence gathering and the PEOPLE behind that. Now, especially in S9, that is completely missing. We learned little about Beth and zero about Demitri. There are no personal scenes anymore and there is also little humour. Sadly lacking are the one liners and excellent sarcasm.

I also think they've lost the intelligence of Harry and Ruth with the new writers and reference to philosophers and literature.

The world is now sadly all about explosions and guns.

I never noticed that. I think you are right. The first few series showed a lot about each character and the struggles that each of them faced. It really did go down in the later series.


I don't know about series 9 because I haven't seen it yet, but that doesn't sound great. I still will like the action and all, but character development can definitely help. I guess that's another reason why I like the earlier series better (but still like all of them in general).

Don't get me wrong I still love the show and it's still the best thing on tv. I just disliked the focus on lucas

I think a lot of the characterisation and humour was lost from season 6 onwards, when they decided to have one storyline run through the entire season. This meant that individual episode time was now taken up by two stories: the through running saga as well as the threat of the week story. This leaves basically no time for the little character beats we used to get in earlier seasons.

More's the pity for me, and I would prefer them to drop having a through running story arc each season and rather just concentrate on giving us well-developed threats of the week.