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+--- Thread: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] (/thread-1034.html)
Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - lwhite53 - 19-07-2010 01:30 AM
Ok -- so this is not my favorite ep in this series. It's based on a couple of suppositions that I don't buy:
1) Fiona discovers that her ex-husband is still alive and decides to lure him to England so she can . . . what? I just don't believe that she would do this alone and without some kind of plan. I can buy that she wanted to protect Adam, and so didn't want to involve him, but the idea that she'd take on a ruthless Syrian intelligence operative solo just doesn't make sense, imo.
2) Farook comes into the country disguised as a Kuwaiti diplomat and waltzes through a very cursory immigration check at a private air strip. And this after 9/11 -- be serious! There's no way anyone coming from the Middle East is getting into any western country that easily.
There were some things in the ep that I thought were good -- the music, for instance, is terrific. Also, I thought Olga S. (and the cameramen) covered her pregnancy really well. Ruth being the one to figure out what was really happening just reinforces her brilliance at lateral thinking and her ability to put together disparate pieces to complete the puzzle.
I enjoyed that the audience had much more knowledge than the spooks about Fiona's motivations up until minute 43 in the ep, when Ruth finally cottoned onto what was happening. Also thought seeing how quickly Juliet got onboard with assassinating a foreign national (no qualms whatsoever) just reinforces the idea that she has absolutely no scruples. And Harry taking a shot at Juliet was great: "Ah, the beast of deniability rears it's ugly head yet again."
A couple of very good guest performers in this ep; the woman who played Fiona's friend was absolutely terrific in their scenes together and Darryl D'Silva was one scary dude as Farook.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - Tea Lady - 19-07-2010 10:21 AM
(19-07-2010 01:30 AM)lwhite53 Wrote: 2) Farook comes into the country disguised as a Kuwaiti diplomat and waltzes through a very cursory immigration check at a private air strip. And this after 9/11 -- be serious! There's no way anyone coming from the Middle East is getting into any western country that easily.
I agree that this is not a particularly exciting episode until about the 50th minute. It all just seemed a little OTT. Like lwhite53 says, how did Fiona expect to beat the Syrian's? If she had a death wish, why? She had little Wes to think about and clearly didn't.
With regarding the private air strip comments I have to disagree slightly. They are certainly not policed like the main airports are, like Gatwick and Heathrow. Even at one of the main airports, only a few years ago, a man wanted for shooting a female police officer dead, escaped by dressing as a woman. He went through airport security dressed like this and because we are so politically correct here in the UK, no one in security asked to look under the burka. I am not sure whether things have now changed after this came to light, but heaven knows how many people came in and out of the UK using this method in the years after 9/11.
Other comments about this episode -
1) Why does Zaf always get to be the waiter? Also did you notice his name on his name tag. If was Tariq.
2) I liked the "Hustle" type moment when this showed how they put the drug in the mint sauce.
3) Loved the exchange between Harry and Juliet.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - Silktie - 20-07-2010 06:05 AM
This isn't one of my favourites either. Apart from the issues mentioned by lwhite, I find that Fiona's death doesn't affect me as much emotionally as it should, and I'm not sure why that is. I liked her as a character, and yet her death scene just doesn't engage me. Maybe it's because the whole thing is so pointless, and could have been avoided with a little more clear thinking from Fiona's side.
Ruth was brilliant, as usual, and you could really begin to see the close bond of friendship she is forming with Adam in this episode. That relationship is one of my favourites over all the series.
I felt sorry for Jo - she was in a no-win situation here with Fiona using her uncertainty as a newby to play her a little bit. I give her points for telling Zaf so quickly what was happening.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - JHyde - 20-07-2010 09:07 AM
I think of this episode as a bit like 2.5 (I Spy Apocalypse). It is powerful the first time you see it but doesn't play as well on repeat viewings.
To be fair, even when I saw it the first time, I could pick the holes in it. As you say - a better trap could have been laid, as a team.
I remember my sister and I having a long protracted argument about this one, about how Fi's death could have been averted.
As you say Silktie, one of the best things about it is seeing Ruth and Adam's relationship solidify (I think of this as the counterpoint to 3.10 in their dynamic's development). I also find RPJ pretty good in this episode - he is positively terrifying as he breaks Farook's lackey's fingers.
Having said that, I cried the first and maybe the second times I watched it. I do find Fiona stabbing Farook a satisfying moment, but ultimately it all felt a little foolish. I was sorry to see both Olga and Fiona leave.
I think this is one of the weaker episodes in the strongest season of the show so far.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - Kazters - 20-07-2010 11:05 AM
its jo that annoys me in this ep! she lets fiona walk all over her which i can see why it just gets me
i never liked fiona i didnt warm to her at all! that said it was a rather tragic way to go and does slightly mirror the end of s3!
i agree about adam being terrifiying at moments in this ep!
i love the lighting on the shot where he cradles her its a stunning shot before it goes white.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - allanah - 21-07-2010 11:52 AM
Jo, who's only been with MI5 for a week or two at this stage, is actually pretty streetsmart in this episode compared to Fiona.
She argues against Fiona, who is a way more experienced officer and has been put in charge of Jo on the mission and then follows her own instincts to call MI5 early against Fiona's advice.
If you watch the series MI5 has a very strong chain of command. Officers have to follow the orders of their senior officers even if they disagree with what is being proposed. That is because as the more experienced officer the senior officer's judgement is expected to be superior to the junior officer. This is generally true (with a few exceptions where people take matters into their own hands) but would apply much more strongly the case with Fiona/ Jo as Jo was only a few weeks out of training than for example Ros/ Lucas where the two have a similar level of experience and a little more leeway.
Fiona on the other appears to have completely taken leave of her senses. She actively goes in to a situation she knows is going to be dangerous and where she is going to be outnumbered with no backup, no support and without telling the rest of MI5 what the real situation is and how dangerous it is. I also agree that she plays Jo by not revealing her intentions until the last possible moment and then effectively pulling rank on her.
The only ones who can really be held responsible for Fiona's death are her ex husband and Fiona herself for her complete lack of judgement.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - Kazters - 21-07-2010 01:06 PM
fiona does go off on her own - she knows exactly what she is doing i often wonder whether she was looking for the outcome she got!
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - A Cousin - 21-07-2010 03:23 PM
Simply put, this episode is an excuse to write out Fiona. They may have sacrificed plausibility of detail. I have always wondered if Fiona was created with this sort end in mind (and Adam's subsequent disintegration) or if it was dreamt up when it was agreed that OS was going to leave the show.
Maybe I am just muddled as I so often am, but the big question in my mind is why was Farook not hanged? Clearly he was supposed to be and he wouldn't have been a friend of the Syrian government unless they didn't believe Adam's set up. Which I guess is possible, but in that case why would he be on the run? I guess he escaped?
I liked Fiona. I was sorry to see her go. I liked the character, the exploration of spooks with a family plots, the actress, and I thought there was some really good chemistry between OS and RPJ. This episode was the most development we get for Fiona. I think her actions in this episode are motivated by guilt and the misguided desire to "protect" Adam and avenge her friends. I think she knew she may not make it out alive.
The general structure of the episode is compelling. I liked the parallel plots until at minute 50 the boulder starts rolling uncontrollably down the hill until it smashes directly into Adam and Fiona.
I like the Coffee Op banter with Malcolm, Colin and Adam. It sounded slightly improvised to me.
On a macbre note, the makeup on Adam during the torture scenes in the beginning is great and I love how the blood spurts out of Farooks shoulder onto the wall after Fiona stabs him? Nice touch.
And because I can't join this discussion without adding something about Harry and Ruth, there is a great look from Harry to Ruth when he is on the phone to Adam and refusing to give him the info he needs because of embassy protocols. At that moment Harry has to make a decision between the professional and the personal. Just after he glances at Ruth he goes for the personal.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - Silktie - 21-07-2010 03:25 PM
What does anyone else think about the idea of Britain interfering in the politics of another country in the hope of installing a new person in power that they can control? Living in Africa, and having seen first-hand the disastrous consequences it can have when a superpower installs someone sympathetic to them, and then turning a blind eye when that person turns into a despot against his own people, I take a very dim view of this. I can see where Juliet is coming from when she authorises this, but as Harry points out, when has this ploy ever turned out well? Perhaps Juliet should pay attention to the lessons history has to offer.
RE: Episode 7 Discussion [rewatch] - Tea Lady - 21-07-2010 05:37 PM
(21-07-2010 03:25 PM)Silktie Wrote: What does anyone else think about the idea of Britain interfering in the politics of another country in the hope of installing a new person in power that they can control? Living in Africa, and having seen first-hand the disastrous consequences it can have when a superpower installs someone sympathetic to them, and then turning a blind eye when that person turns into a despot against his own people, I take a very dim view of this. I can see where Juliet is coming from when she authorises this, but as Harry points out, when has this ploy ever turned out well? Perhaps Juliet should pay attention to the lessons history has to offer.
This is a difficult question to answer. The British army did go into Sierra Leone in 1999 to help support an uprising against the Government, which the British Governement obviously supported, but I think this was with the agreement of the UN. I guess though, if the British Government had not liked the Governemnt in power it probably would have just left the country to implode. I do see your point about not interfering Silktie but I do see Countries like Zimbabwe and Somalia and wish that someone, somewhere, would have the balls to do something. Is doing nothing always the best option just because you are afraid it could turn out badly? Difficult one.