[spoilers] Harry and Ruth Strike Back

[A Cousin]

(04-08-2010 04:36 PM)Silktie Wrote:  

(03-08-2010 04:25 PM)Tea Lady Wrote:  I know I am pretty much on my own going for 2003 but my final thought is, if it was as late as 2005, when Harry already had feelings for Ruth, strong feelings, why would he take her to the most dangerous place in the world at that time i.e. Baghdad?

Well... Now that is a very good point, TL! The only explanation I can think of is that he felt she was the only one he trusted enough at that stage, and that it was something he couldn't do on his own.

Yeah, well, that is the flaw in my plan... (to quote Lucas)

Seriously though, I have grappled with that in my brain and I would agree it does make things sticky. A normal person might think twice about putting the person they love and respect above all others in this kind of dangerous position, but Harry is not a normal person. He also has a huge ability to sublimate and compartmentalize his feelings. It wouldn't be the first time Harry put an Operational need in front of a personal qualms he may have. I can only imagine that he did so with a large amount of effort though and only because there was no other choice.

[JHyde]

As much as Harry liked Ruth, he would still put operational needs first. Let's not get TOO mushy here guys.

[lwhite53]

I'm not sure this timeline question really has a plausible definitive answer because Ruth's knowing about the uranium is basically just a plot device to get her written back into the series. I think the writers purposely kept this all very vague so they wouldn't have to come up with a detailed backstory (when, why, who) to explain her involvement. It's a typical spooks non sequitur that happens because the script needs it to happen.

If I had to speculate, I'd go with A Cousin's timeline a few pages back -- it's logical and makes both political sense and seems true to the H/R relationship.

This is another of those "suspending disbelief" moments, I fear.

[JHyde]

Yeah, that ambiguity is one of the reasons why we may not do it. The thing is, if we DO decide to write Ruth's Diary picking up again at 8.1, we're going to need a timeline, even if we don't keep a record of it earlier on.

Anyway, thanks guys. If you haven't weighed in, feel free to do so but also feel free to talk about other HR stuff.

[Silktie]

So, series 5 sees the real overt start of the Harry/Ruth relationship. Ruth's concern for Harry in 5.2 is really sweet. I wonder, though, do you think Harry still would have asked Ruth out in 5.3 if Juliet hadn't told him in 5.2 that Ruth was in love with him? I'm actually not sure he would have. I think he wasn't sure about Ruth's feelings for him at this stage, and this uncertainty is probably what prevented him from making a move earlier.

I'm bummed that we didn't get a scene where Harry gets back to the Grid after his incarceration in 5.2 - wonder how Ruth greeted him?

[SPOOK91]

Personally I don't think that Harry would have asked Ruth out had Juliet not intervened, like you said Silktie, he was unsure about her feelings towards him, and him being flat out rejected by him would have effected their working relationship as well as their personal relationship. I think he probably had a good idea about her feelings but possibly thought that she didn't feel as strongly for him as he did for her. After 3.9 and the little smirk he has after her pacing comment I think he has the idea that she most probably fancies him. I'm sure something to that effect was said on the commentry for that episode for that matter.

[Tea Lady]

I haven't done my homework yet this week but I don't believe Harry would have asked Ruth out without Juliet giving him that little push. But I always wonder whether Havensworth would have turned out differently if they had not already gone on a date. The dinner date and Ruth's rejection after, made the whole situation at Havensworth awkward to say the least. But if Havensworth was the first time they were thrown together, without Ruth having suffered "gossiping Grid" they may have just had a happy ending at Havensworth.

[SPOOK91]

Perhaps so, Havensworth was particularly awkward between them. Mainly because of her rejection of him previously. Perhaps if they hadn't been out for their meal things would have been different at Havensworth, however, we wouldn't have had that rather lovely look from Harry

Perhaps though with Ruth knowing just how good the surveillence was on the operation she still may have been a little reluctant.

[lwhite53]

I got the feeling that H and R must have had some kind of interaction between 4.10 and 5.1 because of how easy they seemed to be in each other's company by the time we see them in 5.1 and 5.2. They glance at each other more, he allows her to break into his phone call with Adam re finding a nanny for Wes, they're sitting next to each other on the sofa after Colin's death and Harry has his arm where it's almost touching her, etc. They just seem to be more comfortable together than previously. Juliet may have spurred H along, but I think he was moving in this direction already.

[SPOOK91]

True, he seems to be a lot closer to her physically. Perhaps the events of 4.10 pushed him in that direction?