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Caitlinhg · 28-10-2010, 03:35 AM

I've been watching Series 4 again, and I came across the first time we all heard about OMEGA: Series 04, EP 02, Sc 02. Perhaps it will be useful to throw this information into the discussion here:

Harry is being blackmailed by the newly returned from America, Juliet. He goes to the Home Sec. and tenders his resignation. When the HS asks him why, Harry says "During the 1970's I was involved in an highly secret operation called OMEGA."

HS: "I know about OMEGA. Terrorist atrocities were staged in Europe to encourage a harder line against Left Wing groups."

Harry: "It originated in American Military Intelligence, but I sanctioned an operation against a West German* politician who was seen as being soft on Communism. Lives were lost and I covered it up."

HS: "... you sanctioned it?"

Harry: "Yes. I placed my trust in a ROGUE AGENT who proved to be highly unstable."

Now, Lucas is too young to have been an agent in the late 1970's, he'd barely be out of his nappies! However, what about Vaughn? Huh

*Koln/Cologne was part of West Germany prior to unification.

BravoNine · 28-10-2010, 04:30 AM

(28-10-2010 01:28 AM)GrendelKhan Wrote:
(27-10-2010 10:30 AM)BravoNine Wrote:
(27-10-2010 10:28 AM)GrendelKhan Wrote: I think Lucas is doing all of this to smoke somebody out. Just can't believe he's doing it all for a woman.
If not that he's done.

Well it is more than just for a woman, it is more about the terrible secret that he doesn't want to come out more than Maya. Maya and this secret is the leverage Vaughn is using against Lucas.

Don't you think that Harry already knows this secret.
I mean they go back to when you're in diapers before you can join any security service.
So what if Maya finds out? If she loves him, she'll forgive him.

I would think they would have found out, but considering the type of vetting security at MI5 and the number of moles that have wandered in and out of this place, I can't say I place much faith in their background checks anymore. There is only so many moles you can discover before it becomes rather silly. And considering the number of surprises and betrayals MI5 has faced over the last 9 series, I can not say with certainty that Harry knows.

And as for Maya finding out......that is where one has to understand Lucas's character and his desperation. Maya and MI5 are the ONLY things he has left in his life, he CAN'T risk ANY chance of losing them. It's not about Maya forgiving him or not, it's about that Lucas simply CANNOT face any chance that this secret will come out and ruin everything he has worked to gain. Maya is his chance at love, MI5 is his home, if he loses any of those things, he will be destroyed.

This is more about Lucas's psyche than anything else, he just simply CANNOT deal with the possibility that the truth can come out because it can go wrong at any time. He can't risk the chance of Maya's rejection or MI5's hate, he simply can't. This is his life, his everything, it's too big for him to risk losing.

(28-10-2010 03:35 AM)Caitlinhg Wrote: Harry: "Yes. I placed my trust in a ROGUE AGENT who proved to be highly unstable."

Now, Lucas is too young to have been an agent in the late 1970's, he'd barely be out of his nappies! However, what about Vaughn?

*Koln/Cologne was part of West Germany prior to unification.

Hmmmm this is interesting indeed, it would certainly be cool if they can tie Vaughn back to old cases!!!

femaleBertieWooster · 28-10-2010, 05:23 AM

(28-10-2010 03:35 AM)Caitlinhg Wrote: I've been watching Series 4 again, and I came across the first time we all heard about OMEGA: Series 04, EP 02, Sc 02. Perhaps it will be useful to throw this information into the discussion here:

Harry is being blackmailed by the newly returned from America, Juliet. He goes to the Home Sec. and tenders his resignation. When the HS asks him why, Harry says "During the 1970's I was involved in an highly secret operation called OMEGA."

HS: "I know about OMEGA. Terrorist atrocities were staged in Europe to encourage a harder line against Left Wing groups."

Harry: "It originated in American Military Intelligence, but I sanctioned an operation against a West German* politician who was seen as being soft on Communism. Lives were lost and I covered it up."

HS: "... you sanctioned it?"

Harry: "Yes. I placed my trust in a ROGUE AGENT who proved to be highly unstable."

Now, Lucas is too young to have been an agent in the late 1970's, he'd barely be out of his nappies! However, what about Vaughn?

*Koln/Cologne was part of West Germany prior to unification.

Good going. I hope the writers remember that. It would have to be something relevant now for Vaughn or his employers since Harry has buried it. Perhaps they want to

Spoiler: show

BravoNine · 28-10-2010, 05:38 AM

I remember a quote from Ros to Lucas about Harry, "Harry sweated blood to get you back here, he'd rather die than ever let anything happen to you"

I sure hope that Harry will really help Lucas solve this gigantic problem!!!

Tea Lady · 28-10-2010, 10:18 AM

(28-10-2010 01:48 AM)femaleBertieWooster Wrote: I think she mentioned Albany because she liked him and wanted to assure him that she wouldn't give away whatever he was hiding.

Getting her out of the trunk and trying to protect her would have already told her that he wasn't going to kill her or let her die.

"She liked him?" I can't really see this I am afraid. He had kidnapped her. Lost her close protection officers. Destroyed her mobile phone. Physically assaulted her. Left her alone with the codes with no protection. Chased her. Threatened her. Pointed a gun at her. Locked her in a car boot. Driven her off at high speed with bullets coming through the car. What does someone have to do to her, for her to hate them then?

She was dying a painful death, barely conscious, scared out of her wits. She was saying anything and everything she knew at that moment, which wasn't very much, to get through to Lucas and have him help her. It didn't work.

theeyeshaveit · 28-10-2010, 11:07 AM

(28-10-2010 10:18 AM)Tea Lady Wrote:
(28-10-2010 01:48 AM)femaleBertieWooster Wrote: I think she mentioned Albany because she liked him and wanted to assure him that she wouldn't give away whatever he was hiding.

Getting her out of the trunk and trying to protect her would have already told her that he wasn't going to kill her or let her die.

"She liked him?" I can't really see this I am afraid. He had kidnapped her. Lost her close protection officers. Destroyed her mobile phone. Physically assaulted her. Left her alone with the codes with no protection. Chased her. Threatened her. Pointed a gun at her. Locked her in a car boot. Driven her off at high speed with bullets coming through the car. What does someone have to do to her, for her to hate them then?

She was dying a painful death, barely conscious, scared out of her wits. She was saying anything and everything she knew at that moment, which wasn't very much, to get through to Lucas and have him help her. It didn't work.

I thought their period of interaction was fascinating and complex. There was a lot going on between them from the moment they met until the end and it veered between nice things and bad very quickly and more than once.

elisabet · 28-10-2010, 11:15 AM

(26-10-2010 07:39 AM)agent68 Wrote: A couple of things I noticed from last night's programme

When Lucas dials for an ambulance and the American girls murmers 'Albany', you can hear the emergency operator asking what service he requires - well at that point there's a beep sound as if the call has been ended but then Lucas gives the operator details. I thought Lucas must have cut the phone call and then pretended to give details so that she would die. However, we then see the emergency services there. Did anyone else notice this?

When Lucas was applying pressure to her neck, it showed his fingers releasing, but to me it looked like his index finger actually kept the pressure on until she fades away.

Maybe there's hope for Lucas yet?

I just asked a colleague with an i-phone 3, and he says there is no bleep when you cut a call. So they either invented that for the plot, or it has something to do with the receiving end, the emergency services.

agent68 · 28-10-2010, 02:35 PM

He used the dead gunman's phone and I'm pretty sure that wasn't an i-phone. I know he did have an i-phone earlier but I thought he threw that away when he realised he wasn't speaking to Harry.

femaleBertieWooster · 28-10-2010, 03:49 PM

(28-10-2010 11:07 AM)theeyeshaveit Wrote:
(28-10-2010 10:18 AM)Tea Lady Wrote:
(28-10-2010 01:48 AM)femaleBertieWooster Wrote: I think she mentioned Albany because she liked him and wanted to assure him that she wouldn't give away whatever he was hiding.

Getting her out of the trunk and trying to protect her would have already told her that he wasn't going to kill her or let her die.

"She liked him?" I can't really see this I am afraid. He had kidnapped her. Lost her close protection officers. Destroyed her mobile phone. Physically assaulted her. Left her alone with the codes with no protection. Chased her. Threatened her. Pointed a gun at her. Locked her in a car boot. Driven her off at high speed with bullets coming through the car. What does someone have to do to her, for her to hate them then?

She was dying a painful death, barely conscious, scared out of her wits. She was saying anything and everything she knew at that moment, which wasn't very much, to get through to Lucas and have him help her. It didn't work.

I thought their period of interaction was fascinating and complex. There was a lot going on between them from the moment they met until the end and it veered between nice things and bad very quickly and more than once.

Thank you. Tea Lady had me on the ropes there for a minute. I was starting to worry about my poor little psyche. Danielle was a smart but simple kind of person and he was trying to protect her towards the end.

In the US, they record all emergency calls, fire, police or ambulance and there is beeping to signify this. He gave detailed information to the operator. (I also vaguely remember that after the beep, when he didn't speak, the operator prompted him for information.) Since Danielle had no idea where she was, if he wasn't speaking into a live phone, there was no reason to do that. In addition, he could have just walked over and stood looking down on her until she died.

Who Needs Bond · 28-10-2010, 03:50 PM

(28-10-2010 11:15 AM)elisabet Wrote: I just asked a colleague with an i-phone 3, and he says there is no bleep when you cut a call. So they either invented that for the plot, or it has something to do with the receiving end, the emergency services.

I wouldn't put much faith in that, how often on TV do we hear dialing tones etc when characters are using mobile phones...

Also, I dialed 999 (actually 112 - but same thing) for an ambulance a few weeks ago and don't recall there being a "beep" to signify the call was being recorded...they are all recorded...though perhaps it could be when he was being transferred from the 999 call handler to the Ambulance Call Handler...

Also, I asked my girlfriend (who is a Doctor and has worked in A&E) whether she thought Danielle could have survived the gunshot wound to her neck and she said that for that amount of bleeding the bullet would almost certainly have also hit either her windpipe or spine...so bleeding out would have been the least of her worries...