[spoilers] Harry and Ruth. The Wonder Years.

[BravoNine]

The way I see it, these two are being stubborn mules, both love each other, but refuse to admit their feelings and refuse to see that getting it out into the open is better than stealing glances and hiding it.

And they wonder why the baby-spooks are so stubborn....clearly the kids take after Mama and Papa.....LOL

[Silktie]

(01-12-2010 07:34 AM)DogSoSmall Wrote:  I appreciated binkie's answer to my question about why can't this work, but it all still seems very ephemeral to me. What is it about humans that they seem to long for tragedy over happiness? Apparently realism and intellectual integrity demands it, but why? Two people love each other. So be together. There is no moral dilemma here other than a contrived one. They both have the same moral code. If they endanger the country by being together, then so does every single person who works for the intelligence services and has a partner, a child, a parent, a good friend. Should everyone in that job just be an island in order to have a successful career? Anyway, we've already seen that it's not being a couple that affects Harry's decisions. He chose to save Ruth after she had rejected him. Honest acknowledgment of their feelings and how they would want the other to react in future moral dilemma situations is the only useful way forwards.
Hope springs eternal!!

Yeah, I'm with you. There's a lot to be said for eternal optimism. For me, until one of them very definitvely tells the other one that they don't love them, or you know, one of them actually dies, there will remain hope that they can sort themselves out. Ruth may have said no to marriage, but she's never said to anyone that she doesn't love Harry.

Besides, I do love watching them try to make sense of it all.

It brings a bit of a human element to the show.

[A Cousin]

(01-12-2010 07:29 AM)BravoNine Wrote:  He returns to Penelope after his long journey trying to get home, it is told in the Odyssey tale written by Homer. Odysseus returns home with the help of Goddess Athena and son Telemachus and take down the suitors who are trying to court Penelope and planning Telemachus's death.

Only after faffing about with Calypso for 7 years and finding out that the suitors are threatening his kingship. Odysseus returns disguised as a beggar by Athena. Again with Athena's help, Penelope devises a test for all suitors of whoever can string Odysseus' bow and shoot an arrow through 12 axe shafts can have her hand. Of course, this is also rigged, because, presumably, the only one who can use Odysseus' bow properly is Odysseus. Of course, he wins and proceeds to murder all of the suitors.

Penelope is a really fascinating character. To some, in a world where women were controlled completely by their men (father, husband, son) the fact that Penelope kept her suitors at bay for that long implies that she wanted to remain in control of the estate. She is an interesting combination of faithfulness and cunning. Which I also think is somewhat appropriate in regards to Ruth.

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(01-12-2010 07:34 AM)DogSoSmall Wrote:  Should everyone in that job just be an island in order to have a successful career?

And there it is, in a nutshell. That is what I like to watch. Although I am not sure it is just about having a successful career as being able to do ones duty AND remain a connected human being.

[DogSoSmall]

Aha, this just gets better and better!

There's definitely been more than enough faffing, so maybe it's time for Harry to return to be confronted by another suitor. I'm thinking Ruth might draft in Alec for help in clearing Harry and a little frisson may develop. Harry will then be required to prove he is a better man than Alec (which he can do just by being in the room, of course). Sorry, I appreciate this is degenerating into the realms of fanfic. I'll shut up now. But thanks for the classics lesson.

[yorkshiretyke]

As I am snowed in in darkest Yorkshire I have been watching series 8....how HandR have changed, in series 8 it appeared to be all Ruth, hand touches, looks, offers of drinks but then Ros goes and gets herself killed and bang! Ruth is angry and bitter, Harry appears to be grieving and desperate for comfort from Ruth (and not getting it!)...so surely series 10 should be a new dawn for both of them...

Question of the day...should I rewatch series 9, something I have put off as I found it too heartbreaking??

[Silktie]

I recommend re-watching season 9 through cheesecake goggles - it's amazing how many little looks one notices Ruth giving Harry on the second viewing, especially in eps 9.3 and 9.4. (Okay, that's how far I've progressed with my re-watch...)

[DogSoSmall]

Don't talk about re-watching it! It's off bbc iplayer and not yet on dvd and I'm definitely getting withdrawal symptoms now!

[yorkshiretyke]

Its due for release at the end of Feb....so only about 10 weeks....and just think how much you will enjoy it...Silktie, think I might watch a Disney film instead, I need a happy ending!

[Belle]

Bit late to join the discussion , so this has propably been said before, please accept my appologies in case this is an old item,
but maybe Ruth said no to Harry because she 's affraid of getting hurt and won't be able to cope with more grief.
If they remain 'just' colleagues, then maybe in Ruths mind, the pain if something happens to Harry will be more 'bearable', if they would be actual lovers she might think she wouldn't know how to handle it? After all the grief she's been going trough with colleagues being killed or the life with George and Nico she had to leave behind, she might think she wouldn't be strong enough to 'survive' another loss?
I think she said no, no matter how much she loves Harry and he loves her (or maybe because), to protect herself from further pain.

[Silktie]

Hiya and welcome, we're always happy to get new posters on this thread.

I think it's quite possible you're right, although that said, there probably isn't only one reason why Ruth said no. And if not wanting to get hurt if something happened to Harry was her main reason, it's a pretty bad reason in my view. It will hurt like hell even if she isn't in a relationship with him, because she loves him so much. So she might as well enjoy being with him, just in case nothing does happen to him. How will she feel if they both live to be eighty, but she let her opportunity for happiness pass just because something may have happened to him?