[spoilers] Lucas and his tattoos

[JHyde]

Guys, this thread is about the tattoos. You're better off taking this over to the Lucas thread.

[HellsBells]

Not sure if this is mention elsewhere, but in the commentary for 9.7 Andrew Woodhead (Executive Producer) said that the tattoo on Lucas' wrist symbolises a phone number (I don't think he was joking). That would have been a great storyline to use, shame they didn't.

[BoHenley]

Groan...or worse, tell me it's not Maya's phone number...

[Byatil]

(04-03-2011 08:58 PM)BoHenley Wrote:  Groan...or worse, tell me it's not Maya's phone number...

I damn well hope not

If it's supposed to be a phone number... how exactly is it represented? I seem to remember a Russian-speaking forum member commenting that it "didn't mean anything" in Russian, and was just a random assortment of letters or something similar? Does anyone know exactly what the tattoo says? It seems odd that they'd put it there and then refrain from explaining its significance.

[binkie]

(04-03-2011 09:24 PM)Byatil Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 08:58 PM)BoHenley Wrote:  Groan...or worse, tell me it's not Maya's phone number...

I damn well hope not

If it's supposed to be a phone number... how exactly is it represented? I seem to remember a Russian-speaking forum member commenting that it "didn't mean anything" in Russian, and was just a random assortment of letters or something similar? Does anyone know exactly what the tattoo says? It seems odd that they'd put it there and then refrain from explaining its significance.

Cyrillic alphabets, like semitic alphabets, have numerical and valuative determinations for letters and letter groups. In the case of the Russian cyrillic alphabet, really quick and superficial research suggests the following:

Д - Good (numeral value 4)

Ж - Live [instructive, as a verb] (no numeral value)

The character in the middle of the wrist tattoo is unclear in pictures I can find. In some cases, it appears to be a charcter resembling Ц - which could have a meaning relating to hunting or foraging (and no clear numeric attribute) - and in others it appears to be more like Л - which indicates people, and has a numeric value of 30. I'm not sure whether this is a result of wrongly applied transfers, or of a lack of communication as to the communicative intention of the tattoo.

I don't speak Russian, by the way, so feel free to ignore any and all of the above

[Byatil]

(04-03-2011 10:57 PM)binkie Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 09:24 PM)Byatil Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 08:58 PM)BoHenley Wrote:  Groan...or worse, tell me it's not Maya's phone number...

I damn well hope not

If it's supposed to be a phone number... how exactly is it represented? I seem to remember a Russian-speaking forum member commenting that it "didn't mean anything" in Russian, and was just a random assortment of letters or something similar? Does anyone know exactly what the tattoo says? It seems odd that they'd put it there and then refrain from explaining its significance.

Cyrillic alphabets, like semitic alphabets, have numerical and valuative determinations for letters and letter groups. In the case of the Russian cyrillic alphabet, really quick and superficial research suggests the following:

Д - Good (numeral value 4)

Ж - Live [instructive, as a verb] (no numeral value)

The character in the middle of the wrist tattoo is unclear in pictures I can find. In some cases, it appears to be a charcter resembling Ц - which could have a meaning relating to hunting or foraging (and no clear numeric attribute) - and in others it appears to be more like Л - which indicates people, and has a numeric value of 30. I'm not sure whether this is a result of wrongly applied transfers, or of a lack of communication as to the communicative intention of the tattoo.

I don't speak Russian, by the way, so feel free to ignore any and all of the above

And the tattoo is applied in the order "ДЖЦ"?

DZHTS (or DZHL if we assume the last character to be Л rather than Ц) is the translation google provides for the "phrase" (if we can call it that...) which I'm assuming could be an acronym if that is the intended reading of it. If it is supposed to be a number of some description, could the numbers 4 and 30 be combined into any recognisable phone number? DZHL could possibly be a numerical code: 4, 26, 8, 11. Or if we use DZHTS: 4, 26, 8, 20, 19. Assuming we use the latter numerical code, it is possible it could be some form of phone number, as the final 2 digits required would presumably be an area code?

I'm more inclined to believe that the translation was supposed to be along the lines of "Good, Live, Hunt" or something similar. It ties in with "Whilst I live, I hope/breathe", the fact that Lucas/John was trying to be "good" (searching for redemption in the case of John, or simply working to make Britain a safer place in the case of Lucas), and "hunt(ing)" could refer to his job.

Or of course, it could have several meanings If only they'd just tell us!

[binkie]

(04-03-2011 11:29 PM)Byatil Wrote:  And the tattoo is applied in the order "ДЖЦ"?

As far as I can tell, it is applied in the order ДЦЖ (or ДЛЖ).


I spent a goodly portion of my MLIS looking at cataloguing techniques for non-Latin texts, and the bad news is, I really wouldn't rely on Google Translate or Babelfish for anything useful where making sense of the meaning of this is concerned. The best any tool like these can manage in the case of a non-Latin alphabet is basic transliteration, which is no use to anyone.

(04-03-2011 11:29 PM)Byatil Wrote:  Or of course, it could have several meanings If only they'd just tell us!

And good luck with that!

[Byatil]

(04-03-2011 11:48 PM)binkie Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 11:29 PM)Byatil Wrote:  And the tattoo is applied in the order "ДЖЦ"?

As far as I can tell, it is applied in the order ДЦЖ (or ДЛЖ).


I spent a goodly portion of my MLIS looking at cataloguing techniques for non-Latin texts, and the bad news is, I really wouldn't rely on Google Translate or Babelfish for anything useful where making sense of the meaning of this is concerned. The best any tool like these can manage in the case of a non-Latin alphabet is basic transliteration, which is no use to anyone.

I was hoping google might provide me with a basic translation, but it seems I may have to start pestering professors of Russian literature for their professional opinions on the matter...?!

[binkie]

(05-03-2011 12:13 AM)Byatil Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 11:48 PM)binkie Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 11:29 PM)Byatil Wrote:  And the tattoo is applied in the order "ДЖЦ"?

As far as I can tell, it is applied in the order ДЦЖ (or ДЛЖ).


I spent a goodly portion of my MLIS looking at cataloguing techniques for non-Latin texts, and the bad news is, I really wouldn't rely on Google Translate or Babelfish for anything useful where making sense of the meaning of this is concerned. The best any tool like these can manage in the case of a non-Latin alphabet is basic transliteration, which is no use to anyone.

I was hoping google might provide me with a basic translation, but it seems I may have to start pestering professors of Russian literature for their professional opinions on the matter...?!

Yeah, just rack up that list of professors of Russian literature from your pool of contacts Actually, from what I've seen on this forum of your resourcefulness and creative judgment, it would not surprise me in the least if you started tracking down staff from the language faculty at the nearest university!

[Byatil]

(05-03-2011 12:18 AM)binkie Wrote:  

(05-03-2011 12:13 AM)Byatil Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 11:48 PM)binkie Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 11:29 PM)Byatil Wrote:  And the tattoo is applied in the order "ДЖЦ"?

As far as I can tell, it is applied in the order ДЦЖ (or ДЛЖ).


I spent a goodly portion of my MLIS looking at cataloguing techniques for non-Latin texts, and the bad news is, I really wouldn't rely on Google Translate or Babelfish for anything useful where making sense of the meaning of this is concerned. The best any tool like these can manage in the case of a non-Latin alphabet is basic transliteration, which is no use to anyone.

I was hoping google might provide me with a basic translation, but it seems I may have to start pestering professors of Russian literature for their professional opinions on the matter...?!

Yeah, just rack up that list of professors of Russian literature from your pool of contacts Actually, from what I've seen on this forum of your resourcefulness and creative judgment, it would not surprise me in the least if you started tracking down staff from the language faculty at the nearest university!

Don't put it past me, I have been known to hassle Californian professors of Latin for their opinions on certain phrasings before... Luckily most of the people I've e-mailed in the past have been extremely helpful and not at all bothered by my ridiculous questioning!