Episode 2 Discussion [Rewatch]

[Tea Lady]

Please discuss if you have done your homework.

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I really liked this episode. It's a shame the writers were predicting the future. It shows how desperate the security services were to use a young boy like Johnny as an asset, to try and get information. They had little choice though as they had no other assets which was probably not helped by Tessa concentrating on her fictitious ones.

Ruth seemed to be welcomed more warmly than Sam was, although I really hated Ruth's entry into the series. I found it a little embarrassing and had to look away. Ruth also seemed to be talking in a funny way. There was no need for this, dropping the papers was enough to try and make her look nervous and clumsy. I loved the Harry joke moment but really for the look Zoe gave more than anything. It was like Zoe was saying to Harry "what the hell are you doing?"

I liked Khaldun in this episode. The actor was very good and believable. He believed in Paradise but not getting there by taking other people's lives. The writers were trying to promote a positive side to the muslim community in the UK as well as the more radical Islamist side which seems to get in the press more.

We got to see a bit more of Christine in this episode although I found her "come to bed eyes" she gave Tom in the meeting room as quite disturbing. It actually says on the extra's on this DVD that she was in this series because the writers had only planned for another 6-8 episodes and then the BBC said they wanted 13. This was finally reduced to 10 but they did not have enough material on the characters to stretch over 10 episodes, so shoved in Christine to give Tom a bit more to do. Wish he had shoved her in the Thames!

[lwhite53]

This ep is one of my all-time favorites. I love the story (split in the Muslim community, the ambiguous morality of using a young, inexperienced asset), the sense of helplessness of the "official powers" in dealing with the issue (true in all Western countries), and the incredible portrayals of the guest actors (Johnny, Rashid, Azzum, Khaldun). And, of course, we meet Ruth Evershed.

I know many people cringed at Ruth's intro scene and the "lamp" scene, but I loved them. She is a truly unique character in the grid environment and giving her a totally different personna to the rest of the inhabitants made her stand out, imo, as opposed to Sam, who was absorbed into the grid without much ado. You just know Ruth is someone to pay attention to, especially after her "Bugger the Home Office" line; "bonkers but brilliant."

I loved the cultural disparities portrayed in this ep, between Western ideas and the unfathomable East:
Rashid: MI5, what a sad apology for an intelligence service. Secret policemen in other countries can arrest, beat, electric shock, kill -- but what can you do? A smear in the press, a meaningless threat. The world I come from must seem utterly uncontrollable to you. And very dangerous.
. . . .
Tom: We have to gain evidence against Rashid.
Khaldun: If he's guilty, kill him -- I see, do we have a clash of cultures here.
Rashid and Khaldun are on opposite sides of the Islamic debate, but they do agree on how to solve problems. Tom is the outsider here, and he knows it.

Having to go to Tessa for help and then being refused -- humiliating for both Tom and Harry, but showed their desperation. And it's Ruth who rescues them, finding Khaldun, an experienced agent and "clean skin." Her first coup.

I loved the scene with Rashid showing Abu Hassan the vest: "Think of this as a martyr's shroud. Wearing this, he enters heaven." Rashid knows exactly how to play the boy -- using the allure of danger, he plays on Hassan's fascination with the forbidden. But Rashid's goal is purely expedient: "It is a sad thing to say, but the best martyrs are dispensible. We have chosen the boy." Rashid manipulates Hassan just as MI5 manipulated Johnny -- both fighting for an end they passionately believe in.

I also loved the tension set up throughout the ep with Khaldun -- who's side is he really on? We're kept guessing almost until the end, when K tries to save Hassan: "Do not interfere with a man who is going to Paradise." K gets the boys attention by acknowledging him as a man who needs to be reckoned with. He recalls him to the moment with talk of football (looking for commonalities) but he can't quite reach him. Tom's assessment of Khaldun is the ep's point: "Actually, he was a hero."

Also, a change of tone in this ep -- first time the on-going drama of Tom's personal life hasn't overshadowed everything.

[Tea Lady]

(31-01-2010 04:37 PM)lwhite53 Wrote:  I know many people cringed at Ruth's intro scene and the "lamp" scene, but I loved them. She is a truly unique character in the grid environment and giving her a totally different personna to the rest of the inhabitants made her stand out, imo, as opposed to Sam, who was absorbed into the grid without much ado. You just know Ruth is someone to pay attention to, especially after her "Bugger the Home Office" line; "bonkers but brilliant."

I understand what you are saying and I dont remember cringing the first time I watched this episode and really laughed at those scenes. I think it's because I so respect Ruth now, and know her character has moved on. Sam was perhaps trying to fit in too well for me. I dont like people trying to be my best friend so quickly at work. I like a bit of chess playing first. Ruth was just carrying on being herself though, bonkers.

I half expected Tessa to change her mind after the look she gave when Tom walked out. That's Tessa for you though I guess.

[lwhite53]

I thought Tessa's look had more to do with "how can I manage to profit from this situation" -- like she was trying to figure out how to screw Tom and Harry with the info Tom had just given her.

[JHyde]

I'm a huge fan of the actor who plays Khaldun, Alexander Siddig. He was really believable as the ruthless, but very human and compassionate university professor turned MI-5 asset.

As to Ruth, it was a mixed bag. That eyeshadow! The lamp! But dropping the files wasn't so bad, really, and finding Khaldun was a huge victory for her so early on.

[Beatriz]

I liked this episode, khaldun was an amazing character, I liked how it all ended, sad, but it's not so easy to convince a boy when he has been brainwashed...

I likeRuth's introduction (hate the eyeshadow too and the blouse), as lwhite53 said, you know she's totally different from all the people working in the Grid.
She's so nervous that she dropes everything she touches, say stupid things, but when it comes to work she's brilliant.

[lwhite53]

(31-01-2010 10:49 PM)JHyde Wrote:  As to Ruth, it was a mixed bag. That eyeshadow! The lamp! But dropping the files wasn't so bad, really, and finding Khaldun was a huge victory for her so early on.

According to Howard Brenton, he made Ruth clumsy because he's clumsy. I guess that's as good a reason as any.

[JHyde]

Ironically, I was going to make a point about Brenton's writing. This is a classic case of where he takes something too far. Some of Ruth's clumsiness works well. Some of it barely escapes farce.

[HellsBells]

I actually liked Ruth clumsiness. It was a great contrast to the others on the Grid who are almost too perfect sometimes. I felt it gave her a more 'human' feel, and a most realistic impression of starting a new job, unlike Sam who just seamed to turn-up and get on with the job.
The storyline was, of course, brilliant. At the end I thought Khaldun would talk the boy out of blowing-up himself, but, this is Spooks !

[Crisitos]

For me this episode it’s one of the reason I love Spooks. It keeps you hesitating about if the new agent it’s reliable or not, and I really like how they created the character because, it’s like someone said, he shows more humanity. And also we can see a different perspective about the bad guys, let's name them like this just for now . I don’t know if I’m got used to see the american prototype of bad guys, but I really like that new perspective where they show us that the bad guys have moral and personal reasons to be like this.

I wasn’t expecting that ending, I really thought

Spoiler: show

that bomb wasn’t going to exploded

, I was expecting to see more of the Khaldun and his relationship with the others characters, because he could brought a whole new perspective to the series.

Ps: Sorry for the grammar mistakes