[spoilers] Harry and Ruth. The Wonder Years.

[A Cousin]

(16-11-2010 04:13 PM)Silktie Wrote:  Upon rewatching 9.1, I'm a little confused as to what the truth is behind Ruth keeping Harry at arm's length. In 9.1 when she rejects his proposal, she clearly says that she can't marry him after the choices he's made - referring, we all assumed, to George and Nico. But in 9.7 she tells him that he's wrong to think that she still blames him for that.

Was she referring to other choices he made in 9.1, and if so, which choices? Or did she only realise when confronted with Nico's photo that she really doesn't blame him for that anymore, and that the problem is that she is apparently dead inside?

I had a little epiphany upon my rewatch of 9.1 the other night that pertains to this question. It is all still very vague in my head, but I'll try to express it succinctly.

Watching it with the knowledge that she doesn't blame Harry for George/Nico, rather that she blames herself for not feeling more guilty about it herself, the thought occurred to me that Ruth is questioning Harry about why it is so easy for him to compartmentalize and seemingly "move on" after "all the choices he has made" from an operational standpoint. The expression on her face after he insists that they "move on from this" is complete confusion at the shift. She then drops the bomb about Nicholas Blake (who says that Harry is the only one with rotten timing? ) and realizes after the fact that he is not reacting very well to the info. Does she know what he is going to do with it? I don't know. But she certainly knows what he did with it after the fact. Which he gives lip-service to as "sad" and she calls his bluff with her "Not really."

To offer my opinion re: your second question, I think she can't express the problem verbally until the conversation in the hospital. I don't think it is any grand revelation. It has always been there. She has just found the words for it. Or maybe she didn't realize that he thought that was why she was holding him off at arms length?

[BravoNine]

Hmmmm funny how I was listening to this song called "Winter Song" by Sara Bareilles and Ingrid Michaelson and it totally reminded me of Harry and Ruth, me thinks I am going to make a video with it!

[Tea Lady]

(16-11-2010 05:39 PM)A Cousin Wrote:  Watching it with the knowledge that she doesn't blame Harry for George/Nico, rather that she blames herself for not feeling more guilty about it herself, the thought occurred to me that Ruth is questioning Harry about why it is so easy for him to compartmentalize and seemingly "move on" after "all the choices he has made" from an operational standpoint.

A good point well made. I just wonder whether Ruth meant what she said, which is why she stopped herself mid-sentence, because it should have been "the choices I've made." Lying to George and Nico, coming back to the Service so quickly, moving on with her life.

Ruth seems to clarify a little on the roof scene later though, as to why she is keeping Harry at a distance. In a nutshell I just think she's scared. Scared of it not working out and her losing Harry for ever this time. Who has Ruth got in her life, but Harry. I don't think she ever blamed Harry for George and Nico, once she had calmed down.

[Naivety]

I also have started rewatching Series 9 - how else to fill the void on Monday nights?

The proposal scene was so clumsy, and yet so lovely. It did match the way they have always been. Ruth flutters her eyelids for a bit and taunts him with the hand touches, Harry makes a move and Ruth backs off sharpish. I love the way Harry puts his arm around her. I think it's the first time he has ever touched her in an intimate way. Even when they kissed in 5.5 he didn't hug Ruth, her just stood there with his hands by his side. If only he had said 'I love you' instead of 'Marry me'. The whole series could have been so different.

[Nia M]

Naivety Wrote:If only he had said 'I love you' instead of 'Marry me'. The whole series could have been so different.

Oh the possibilities!! *wistful sigh*

As it is though, I do think the way S9 turned out was brilliant for them. Ruth tears in 9.8 said it all (although I would have liked even the slightest inkling of a scene between them at the end of this episode...)

[Forever Secret]

(16-11-2010 06:50 PM)Naivety Wrote:  I also have started rewatching Series 9 - how else to fill the void on Monday nights?

The proposal scene was so clumsy, and yet so lovely. It did match the way they have always been. Ruth flutters her eyelids for a bit and taunts him with the hand touches, Harry makes a move and Ruth backs off sharpish. I love the way Harry puts his arm around her. I think it's the first time he has ever touched her in an intimate way. Even when they kissed in 5.5 he didn't hug Ruth, her just stood there with his hands by his side. If only he had said 'I love you' instead of 'Marry me'. The whole series could have been so different.

Oooh I miss monday nights now

I think thats whats so great about, their relationships always been a bit like that, a little clumsy. Its like Ruth can't look at him, if she does she feels she gives too many of emotions away, I think Ruth's scared of that, maybe thats also why she "feels dead inside", if she's dead inside she can't hurt any more than she already does, her compassionate nature makes her feel more vulnerable .
I was never sure if he did stand there with arms by the side in 5.5 I thought he tried to hold ger but I'm not sure,
But they've never really been that intimate, like its been said before, they are soul mates, and what Ruth said, "Couldn't be more together..." perhaps they don't really need it, they already know the extent of each others feelings, it was just never said out loud... I just want them to actually say it to each other
Yes an "I love you!" I'm hoping its actually said in Series 10, I get the feeling it might be their last chance

Ahhh I wanted a scene between them in 9.8 too! Perhaps there's was and we never saw it ... *hoping that 48 hour gap is filled*

[Kirayuki]

(16-11-2010 06:50 PM)Naivety Wrote:  Even when they kissed in 5.5 he didn't hug Ruth, her just stood there with his hands by his side.

Not strictly true. He did hold her sides but we couldn't see it as the camera was on their faces. You can see his arms move... that and there are some photo's taken at the time which show us otherwise. (I think in the personnel files).

However him putting his arm around her is one of my favourite little things about that scene. Apart from that i can't bring myself to watch it again yet. It's too painful.

[Nia M]

(16-11-2010 07:02 PM)Forever Secret Wrote:  Ahhh I wanted a scene between them in 9.8 too! Perhaps there's was and we never saw it ... *hoping that 48 hour gap is filled*

I checked; there definitely wasn't one in the episode
(But oh my goodness am I praying for a deleted scene on the S9 DVD!!)

Still, fanfiction is wonderful at this sort of thing

[A Cousin]

(16-11-2010 07:07 PM)Kirayuki Wrote:  

(16-11-2010 06:50 PM)Naivety Wrote:  Even when they kissed in 5.5 he didn't hug Ruth, her just stood there with his hands by his side.

Not strictly true. He did hold her sides but we couldn't see it as the camera was on their faces. You can see his arms move... that and there are some photo's taken at the time which show us otherwise. (I think in the personnel files).

Thus giving her whispered line "Let me go, Harry." a double meaning. Love that kind of stuff....

[Nia M]

D'you know, I'd never even thought about how this could literally be her telling him to physically let go of her

I just love the other meaning of it