Series 9 Episode 4 discussion

[Nietzsche]

Locking him up in a steel room for his own good is a brilliant idea.

[Tea Lady]

(12-10-2010 03:15 AM)AnnMarie Wrote:  Holy Mother of God! What the heck is going on? Lucas' running to Maya at the hospital was soooo out of character for him. He does not react so emotionally or act that irrationally, no matter WHO he's playing at.

This is very out of character even after the whole Sarah C thing IMO. That just makes me think Lucas is acting like a love sick puppy for his own ends. He was so cold and ruthless when he set that other officer up, and even Vaughn said he didn't really have to do that, that I struggle to believe he did all of that for one woman. Even if she is the love of his life.

The writers seem to have listened to most of the critisism of last season which included comments about Lucas and his love life. I will keep the faith that they have indeed listened on this point and have not made the same mistake again, until the conclusion of this particular thread. Also something about Maya makes me think that she is not a cuddly doctor. From wanting to be a tapas bar owner to actually being a doctor, quite a shift in direction of one's life.

As for the chinese connection. Well that is a complete mystery. Perhaps they were following Vaughn. Perhaps they were the people threatening to kill Vaughn.

Final point. Why the hell did Lucas have his patio door unlocked ?? He lives in London for gods sake. Anything not nailed to the mast is gone in seconds, and he's supposed to be a government officer!!!

[Quill]

Ah, Tea Lady, you touched on something I have been ruminating about it. Maybe it's wishful thinking on my part, but...

What if Lucas actually told Harry what was going on and the two of them are leading Vaughn & Co. into a trap? Ruth is not in it, so her radar is picking up the deception, but she doesn't know what is going on.

The change in Lucas has been too swift. He's convincing as a love-sick sick to Maya. But to us, it sounds false. Setting up a fall guy to take the blame for the stolen file is what Vaughn expects out of him (he throws back at Lucas the same line Lucas used last episode: "Whose life did you ruin this time?"), but it goes against the grain for an agent that is willing to be arrested by the Chinese so the mission can be successful and his colleague can escape. The way Vaughn plays him is too obvious and Lucas was never dumb. I think he's is giving what they want and Harry is probably aware of it. Or he may be setting up a trap to deliver Vaughn to Harry, as he did with Arkady. And what are the chances that Maya is in bed with Vaughn? Why Vaughn would deliver old photos of Maya with Lucas?

Also, thinking about practicalities, what would be the point of killing Lucas, if Kudos signed up for another season? There are no guarantees that Spooks will have a season 11, so introducing a new agent to replace Lucas would be pointless. And if they make Lucas a through-and-through traitor, I think the only way to redeem his character would be in a box, after a bout of self-sacrificing.

[Hunted]

The symbolism in water - the glass of water in Harry's hand, de-salinisation, the Albany picture. I could be reading into nothing but is there an underlying current here?
Completely unintentional but the double-meaning in 'if you don't start knocking soon' from Harry to Ruth was hilarious and gave me a good giggle! C'mon Ruth we know who you want to knock around with! On Ruth, her 'out of office' performance was superb. She is seriously depressed though, as her little chat with Beth showed. Hopefully she can shake off some of this. I am worried for her safety as she has rumpled Lucas, he seems capable of anything at the minute.
Beth has really grown into her role, and it was a great performance from Sophia showing Beth finding her feet and making some mistakes as a new officer, but trusting her instinct. Her scenes with Kai were warm and rang true as a friendship which had been used for nerfarious purposes by her; but her humanity came through. Less smirking this epiosode too!
The picture of Lucas at the end intrigued me - could it be an aid to recognise for the Chinese to recognise him to arrange a meet,or are they hunting him down? Is the 'them' who Vaughan say are after him, the Chinese? Did Vaughan and Lucas get mixed up in something in Africa that pis*sed off Chinese involvement in African affairs.
The corridor scene between Lucas and Maya was slightly cringe-worthy (sorry Lucas fans) and the kiss felt forced. I am not sure if it's lack of chemistry between the actors or something to do with Lucas and Maya manipulating one or the other. I hope they don't overdo this in the next few episodes.

[khananel]

I'm new here and probably amongst the 'older' group of the Spooks viewership. This is in the nature of a very critical review.

I feel that Spooks seems to be heading downhill fast. They replaced Malcolm with Tariq, nice bright kid, but too young to be so 'experienced' with the 'systems' he operates. Even a genius has to have experience... Its like he can take over any IT system in the UK, or the world, at will, and manipulate it instantly and effortlessly. Just too implausible... Or maybe he's a very youthful 35-45...

They got rid of the older lady who turned out to be a traitor. Shame, they didn't replace her with someone from a similar age/experience group, just for balance and plausibility.

The only 'oldies' are Harry and Ruth, both welcome, but both not quite acting as more experienced members of the service. Except for the scenes with Harry and the HS that are very well done.

Now we have Dimitri and Beth who can't be more than mid-20s. Now, did they go through screening? Were they trained up? I only ask this because in Episode 4 everyone seems to act like rank amateurs with the Chinese, and Harry admits as much. 'We were played...' I mean this is the nation's security service not the WI! Everyone now seems too young, too inexperienced, too lovesick and too confused. No wonder the enemies are walking all over them! I yearn for the days of Adam Carter and Roz. And the Lucas thing is so confused. Have they screened him? Is he a double or more agent? Is he effective, psychopathic or merely confused? should he be in the service at all?

And Tariq and his impossibly genius talent for taking over technology at the blink of an eye can't make up for these shortcomings. I mean, that Chinese bomb, so, instead of the whole experience of the Bomb squad and a BDO, we have the new Dimitry, and yes Tariq again doing it all by themselves... Implausiblity gives way to plain disbelief. Its becoming a bit daft or even ridiculous for me.

And they got the new Beth to handle the Chinese guy. In reality (what's that got to do with a good story...?) she would have gone under the wing of a Chinese specialist officer to learn the ropes. I mean the Chinese are know for their inscrutability. You don't put a newbie to handle them, certainly not on her own. Harry should have been dragged over the coals for allowing that. Not a, from Ruth ('oh I forgot the Chinese for...') 'your instincts were wrong this time, better luck next time'. It doesn't make even a little sense any more. And last episode they had the FSB guy in the heart of the Secret Service; why not just make Putin PM of the UKand we'll make the UK a province of the RF like Kaliningrad.

The previous episode, episode 3 was a shambles, so many 'holes' you could drive a coach and horses through. I complained to the BBC about that. In this one they were all merely rank amateurs.

If they carry on like this I may stop watching. A (once great) show going downhill fast. Maybe they are aiming for a younger (perhaps less demanding, finicky, grumpy?) age set. And I may be shot down in flames for my comments here. So be it.

Thank you.

[FATBOY]

Yes lots of tech inaccuracies - when Lucus transfers the £24,000 to the young Mr Owens account using his stolen password I would expect the terminal location (inside the IT suite) to have been logged also. Owen was elsewhere but Lucas was physicaly present. This I expect would also be logged, besides Ruth saw him leave at that time.

All this should get flagged up, if not either Lucus is extremly tech savvy or perhaps, as someone has suggested, Harry knows something about what's going on with Lucas and would cover for him (?)

[Hunted]

(12-10-2010 10:22 AM)FATBOY Wrote:  Yes lots of tech inaccuracies - when Lucus transfers the £24,000 to the young Mr Owens account using his stolen password I would expect the terminal location (inside the IT suite) to have been logged also.

This is bugging me as well. Would Owens not have dropped Lucas in it when he was charged? Something along the lines of 5 minutes before the logged time and the money transfer, I spoke to an agent about a Level 7(?) protocol. IT suites or server rooms would always have in place second level access like a swipe card or fob that Lucas would need to get in.

[nothingisasitseems]

A good episode but it didn't have me on the edge of my seat as the previous week. In fact I would rank the four so far in order as: 3, 1, 4, 2.

The very fact that they are openly casting aspersions and making it seem as if Lucas is a traitor means that there will be a twist at the end. I was gobsmacked though that he set Agent Owens up.

Quite a few (very) fleeting Harry/Ruth moments to savour on the video! Good to see Dimitri have a big part to play - he is fast becoming my fav!

Some parts such as the incursion into the Chinese Embassy were slightly messy.

Ruth beginning to wonder about Lucas will probably devlop into a major storyline.

[FATBOY]

RE: Series 9 Episode 4 discussion
Albany is the name of a software company which makes credit card payment software.

Albany is also an ancient name for "North Britain".

The Royal Marines were originally called the Duke of York and Albany's Maritime Regiment.

Albany is also a region of South Africa noted for it's bio diversity ...... ?

[theeyeshaveit]

Even though I have loved previous series of Spooks, including the last two, this one is proving so engrossing I just wanted to comment on here. I have never been able to treat it as anything but high roller fantasy because plot holes and implausibilities have been present all along the way for me. I do not ponder over the things I notice that are not like real life and that includes most of the dalliances. Apart from some of the issues the stories are about, which can be uncomfortably too real, everything else is just fantasy for me. If only we had a real life troupe that could so conveniently do some of the things our lads and lasses do.

Although, as a Lucas fan, I currently hate what is happening to him and I might end up crying and hating it if he turns out to be bad, ( I am sure Ruth and Harry fans would understand fear for their loved ones ); I am nevertheless loving what I am getting from him and everyone this series so far.

I love the intrigue and twists in the weekly tales and while I have to confess I don't understand Harry and Ruth as a couple, I am enjoying them moving out of a bit of a rut I felt they were in, they are getting and doing some great stuff this series I feel. I love plain ordinary non fashion plate Beth who is playing it by ear as she goes, she is the complete opposite to the cool, always pristine, machine like Roz who I hated losing but am not missing as much as I expected. I never thought I would like the new HS as much as the old either. Dimitri is so far so good.

While I don't like what is happening to Lucas so far because I want him to be a good guy, I have to concede that he has been fascinating.

Ever since Vaughn turned up Lucas is clearly living two lives. He is still functioning as the efficient clear thinking agent on one level, including taking risks against the flow to helps someone ( staying in the embassy for Kei when Harry said they could not get them back if they were taken by the Chinese). Then he is being this other person, uncertain and shaky at least - if not afraid, untrustworthy, emotional, seemingly not thinking very clearly, and seemingly ruthless in what he did to Steve the colleague.

I have no idea what is going on with any of it, not even enough to enter into speculation, all I can do is observe my impressions, but I keenly await the next few weeks probably more than I have since series 1 and 2. I only hope that Lucas turns out ok and that Ruth and Harry get some personal happiness in some way or another.