Series 9 Episode 8 discussion

[BravoNine]

I'm kinda wishing that Spooks had bloopers.....maybe then we can see something funny in the middle of all that emotional scenes....

Like maybe RA being all intense trips over something or forgets his lines and falls on PF when they're on the rooftops? That could be amusing!

[Beatriz]

Wow! This episode kept me on the edge of the seat, maybe I haven't enjoyed it as much as last week's but it was great. This end opens lots of possibilities to develop next series regarding character development.

I agree with the paising of NW, RA and PF, fantastic work. Loved Ruth and Lucas scene, all Harry's looks, he was amazing (his change of clothes, pity we couldn't see more ).

I was afraid of Ruth first and then Harry. And how brilliant was Harry's line: "It's my turn". Loved that he called his daughter, that was lovely and endearing.

I also missed Malcolm in this episode.

Great ending to a brilliant series. Sorry for the random ideas, it's too late here (2am) and have to get up at 6.15!!!

[theeyeshaveit]

Character assassination completed, (not that I believe someone with even the tiniest shred of Lucas in him would emotionally or logically have taken such an immoral and unworkable route), but at least I can be grateful that Harry and Ruth survived intact and other fans won't get to feel the way I do.

I don't see that what Harry did was anything like treason, he knew the file was not really dangerous, so did not gamble with disaster really to get Ruth back. If it had been genuine, I would have not expected him to put it at risk, even for Ruth. I always thought he was up to something that was not as bad as what it looked. I think if Harry would have risked giving a genuine file to the Chinese, then maybe he would not be able to do his job anymore.

I hated the way the writers wanted their cake and to eat it too. The flashbacks to the past and the comforting of Ruth, were like an insulting crumb rubbing salt into the wound to the Lucas believers, yet we were at the same time supposed to feel he was so not Lucas that he would kill Ruth and give the Albany file to the Chinese even after he found out what it contained. Icky!

[tyme4t]

Well Well Well so that was 9.8! Mixed feelings....
Things I was a bit disappointed by:
No Malcolm / the lack of twists / the Chinese agents from earlier in series - where were they ? / Alec White character - ok I admit I was hoping that it was going to be Tom Quinn

Now the stuff I loved!!!!
I loved the exchanges between Lucas/John & Ruth - oh when she starts yelling that she wants to talk to Lucas....so good!
Freaked out a bit when it was Harry who threw in the gas at the church!
I had to giggle at the scene where Lucas asks Harry to strip - all I could think of was BOILER SUIT!
Harry & Lucas scene after Lucas picks up "Albany" - loved them talking to each other over the phones staring at each other
Favourite scene was Harry leaving a message for his daughter...that was the scene that got me sniffling....
Also broke my heart when Lucas/John says he can't go back to prison - THAT was when I knew it was over for him and he was either going to shoot himself or jump

Long Live Section D

[Kirayuki]

And on this episode... Bloomin' Heck!

(Sorry that's about all i can manage to say right now... I'm in emotional turmoil. So much to sort through.)

[BravoNine]

You know, in the midst of all this Harry/Ruth/Lucas stuff, I think we forgot the little ones, just imagine what Dimitri, Beth, and Tariq must be feeling. Lucas has become their big brother figure, he's the one who looks out for them and protects them, and suddenly now he has to be their enemy, and in the middle of all that mess, you got Ruth and Harry, the Mom and Dad of the team, in danger, trying to sort out this mess and emotions are all running high.

And now the little ones have to stand there and watch their family falling apart, a war between their mother, father, and big brother. As hard as it is for Harry/Ruth/Lucas, it must be even harder for the kids watching everything blow up in front of their eyes.

Dimitri and Beth having to be out in the field and watching it all go down with Lucas falling apart, and poor Tariq getting punched by Lucas....at least Lucas didn't hurt him badly, I was worried...but I think there is a part of Lucas still in there that's trying to protect his team and trying not to harm them, I guess that's a consolation....

I really feel so bad for the kiddies. They must be so lost now without Dad and Big Brother....

[GrendelKhan]

That was intense.
Glad all those bloggers were wrong and there will be a series 10.

Sorry that the delicious Richard Armitage is gone.
Wonder what the eye candy will be next season.

[AnnMarie]

For all the fans, when the dust settles, realize one thing, the Harry/Ruth dysfunctional love almost affair is the only thing keeping this show together, and that's not saying much. Most of the posts here are not about the plots or storylines (except Lucas') but about that particular pseudo relationship.

Regarding this season: Plot holes the size of the Grand Canyon, total disrespect for an audience of intelligent people and irrational character (I can't even use the word development because it doesn't fit) deconstruction. How did they address significant plot questions, easy, they DIDN'T! It is as if the show was written by 16 people, who have never seen the last 2 series, locked in separate closets and each told to write a script which was then merged into one. This episode was that discombobulated. And has anyone else noticed that the Alec call up was eerily similar to that of John Porter in Strike Back?

All I asked for was plausibility and that we were denied.

Ruth, get over yourself. You are not a spring chicken anymore and Harry just sacrificed everything for you so suck it up and marry the man when he needs you most. Or else you'll start to remind us of the catatonic Maya.

My darling Mr. Armitage. Your acting was everything I could have hoped for, I felt your pain when Maya died although I did not understand it as she seemed cold to you, but I blame the writers for that and not you. Thank you for the previous 2 series of our hero Lucas which is how I, and the fans, will always remember him. He will live in on in our fanfic as Guy does.

To the writers and producers: You did not acquit yourself with honor (honour for you Brits) this night. I am grateful that you've left Spooks fans something of Harry and Ruth to hang on to because without a decent story that is all that is left.

Lucas North: Rest in Peace- I believe in you

[Adam Carter]

No way Alec is the new Section Chief. The grid needs a dynamic new presence to help fix what is sure to be a mess next year. Very much an Adam redux situation, IMO.

[BravoNine]

(09-11-2010 02:42 AM)AnnMarie Wrote:  Regarding this season: Plot holes the size of the Grand Canyon, total disrespect for an audience of intelligent people and irrational character (I can't even use the word development because it doesn't fit) deconstruction. How did they address significant plot questions, easy, they DIDN'T! It is as if the show was written by 16 people, who have never seen the last 2 series, locked in separate closets and each told to write a script which was then merged into one. This episode was that discombobulated. And has anyone else noticed that the Alec call up was eerily similar to that of John Porter in Strike Back?

All I asked for was plausibility and that we were denied.

They tried to address those plot issues, like how Lucas got into MI5, but it was just an excuse, that because Lucas had done all the vetting, John just easily swooped in....wow I'd like to think MI5's security was better than that....

Plausibility and logic went out the window the moment they stepped on this Lucas-Is-John train and decided not to get off.

And really, adding those flashes from Series 7 and 8 were just like rubbing salt on the wound. And honestly, I don't think I'll ever heal from this.

I've accepted a lot of character exits for my favorites over the years, however sad, however twisted, they made sense and I made peace with it, I didn't whine or complain because I understood it all, and that the storylines made sense, I can see the logic, but this time, this is the first time ever that a storyline has never made sense to me, I expected better from a show of this great caliber.

(09-11-2010 02:42 AM)AnnMarie Wrote:  Ruth, get over yourself. You are not a spring chicken anymore and Harry just sacrificed everything for you so suck it up and marry the man when he needs you most. Or else you'll start to remind us of the catatonic Maya.

You know, I didn't think Lucas was qualified to give anyone marriage advice, but I rest my case this time because Lucas was right when he told Ruth to go for it! If even Lucas can see it, damn it Ruth, why can't you!

(09-11-2010 02:42 AM)AnnMarie Wrote:  My darling Mr. Armitage. Your acting was everything I could have hoped for, I felt your pain when Maya died although I did not understand it as she seemed cold to you, but I blame the writers for that and not you. Thank you for the previous 2 series of our hero Lucas which is how I, and the fans, will always remember him. He will live in on in our fanfic as Guy does.

Richard Armitage is the saving grace of this storyline, he played this tortured tormented soul so well that for one hour, I even forgot the gigantic plot holes and found myself so drawn into the story! He was brilliant, perfect, so haunting, chilling, yet loving and conflicted. And Peter Firth and Nicola Walker both deserves their praises too for leveling the playfield with Richard and bringing in this strong great chemistry! The scenes with Lucas/Ruth and Lucas/Harry would not have worked had it not been for these three brilliant actors carrying the torch!

And as for the Lucas that we all loved so much, the Lucas that I still believe was in there this episode, despite the darkness of John Bateman, I think I did see a shred of Lucas shining through, that part of him that still wanted to protect his team, that still did not want to hurt them anymore than he needed to. He's in there and he decided to end this. In my head, I'll always believe that this monster called John is another personality inside Lucas, and while John may have succeeded in destroying the life Lucas loved, Lucas did make the ultimate sacrifice, he ended this dark monster of John, made sure John could not hurt anyone, including himself. In my head, I'll keep telling myself that. That Lucas won, he jumped because he wanted to stop John, he died a hero.

Good thing I already started my fanfic storyline on this forum, or else this episode would have broken my heart so much that I would not be able to write anything!

(09-11-2010 02:42 AM)AnnMarie Wrote:  Lucas North: Rest in Peace- I believe in you

Me too! I'll never stop believing in you!

(09-11-2010 02:54 AM)Adam Carter Wrote:  No way Alec is the new Section Chief. The grid needs a dynamic new presence to help fix what is sure to be a mess next year. Very much an Adam redux situation, IMO.

A bit like Adam, but I think when Adam died, it was not hell breaking loose on the Grid. Harry was there, Ros was there, and Lucas was there to back everyone up. The team was together. As much as it hurt to loose Adam, they still had each other, the team was ready to go and get revenge.

But this time, this is not like before. The Grid is truly broken this time. Harry, their father figure is under attack. Ruth, their mother figure is in emotional turmoil. Lucas, their big brother figure is dead and left behind a trail of shattered hearts. Dimitri, Beth, and Tariq are not ready, they're neither experienced nor hardened enough to take control of the Grid, they're like kids lost in the crowd and looking for someone to give them direction. They're just babies in this world, taking their first step, except now the three people they are counting on are the ones in danger of breaking and loosing it all. And really, who could they take their revenge from? Lucas? The big brother who is now dead? Even if the team comes to hate him, there's always gonna be a part of them that still loves him, still cares, who knew Lucas North's death would shake up so many people?

This is not gonna be easy to come back from.

And I hope to God that Alec fellow is not new Section Chief or new anything, in fact, I found him to be irritating....