[spoilers] Harry and Ruth: Back With A Vengeance?

[Naivety]

Series 10 Spoiler: show

(19-09-2011 12:17 PM)beatrice4ruth Wrote:  But I do not criticize the actress. She is doing her best under difficult circumstances. To play an unpleasant character must be very challenging. She is elegant but it is not her fault if she looks so ghostly. I wonder whether Kudos is sending us a message with Elena's looks.

We don't know yet if she is going to play an 'unpleasant character'. So far she has played an elegant, graceful and dignified woman, who Harry has loved in the past. The fact that he did love her, probably means she is a good person to know.

And old loves, where you've split up because of duty rather than the dying of the love, will linger on in your head. The flashbacks to them kissing mean he is remembering her fondly, and he was in his office gazing at her photo after the reception which demonstrates that he found meeting her a pleasant experience.

I think we should expect some competition for Ruth, and it may not be a bad thing (in the short term) but it may turn out that Elena is the one to turn Harry down.

It's early days, but I would say that if there are H/R problems at the start of the series, it'll mean a better outcome in the end. **hoping**

Pactum Serva

[Beatriz]

Guys, just a reminder, there's no need for spoiler tags if you are talking about an aired episode, only for not aired episodes and trailers for following episodes.

[beatrice4ruth]

(19-09-2011 03:47 PM)Naivety Wrote:  

Series 10 Spoiler: show

(19-09-2011 12:17 PM)beatrice4ruth Wrote:  But I do not criticize the actress. She is doing her best under difficult circumstances. To play an unpleasant character must be very challenging. She is elegant but it is not her fault if she looks so ghostly. I wonder whether Kudos is sending us a message with Elena's looks.

We don't know yet if she is going to play an 'unpleasant character'. So far she has played an elegant, graceful and dignified woman, who Harry has loved in the past. The fact that he did love her, probably means she is a good person to know.

And old loves, where you've split up because of duty rather than the dying of the love, will linger on in your head. The flashbacks to them kissing mean he is remembering her fondly, and he was in his office gazing at her photo after the reception which demonstrates that he found meeting her a pleasant experience.

I think we should expect some competition for Ruth, and it may not be a bad thing (in the short term) but it may turn out that Elena is the one to turn Harry down.

It's early days, but I would say that if there are H/R problems at the start of the series, it'll mean a better outcome in the end. **hoping**

Pactum Serva

We will not agree about that for sure. That's ok. I still think that Elena by spying on her own people is not an honorable person, even if it was done out of love. Everybody seems to forget about Harry's English family, unless he was not yet married. I have a lot of problems accepting the fact she was not involved with the KGB, knowing the communist system. Perhaps I should think more like Spooks and less like Le Carre.

I do not understand why Kudos is destroying Harry's character at least on the personal level. In episode 1 Harry is portrayed as an adulterer (perhaps somebody could check when he married so that I do not always make the same mistake) and a hypocrite (I'm thinking when he told Adam "You can't seem to keep your trousers on" re Anna).

In that case, is he really worthy of our admiration and by default our love for Elena? My instictive dislike of Elena has nothing to do with Ruth. I just don't trust her. I know that the world of spying is very murky and nothing is what it seems.

I am also concerned

Series 10 Spoiler: show

about the photo of Elena in the hands of the Russians at a meeting. Is she a victim or an active participant?

I am afraid that in Episode 2 Kudos is going to destroy Harry's
professional character. Why? Is Harry a victim too or an masterspy who pulls the strings to destroy MI-5?

Throughout the series there were hints that Harry might not be what he seems. In fact, I am very interested in the evolution of that plot. I still believe that he is an honorable man.

[Silktie]

I'll take my comments on Harry to the appropriate thread, and concentrate here on the HR aspect.

So, another slight reset in the tone of their relationship - after the unease of most of season 9 they are now quite comfortable and pally with each other. Should we deduce from this that they had been seeing a bit of each other while Harry was on gardening leave? But if this was so, why do they only now have the conversation about Lucas? It is said at the start of the Inquiry scene that it is the third day of proceeedings, so perhaps they only saw each other there? And why was Ruth at the Inquiry? Was she there as a witness, or purely to support Harry?

What is clear at least, is that Ruth still supports Harry fully at work, but we don't yet know whether she has made up her mind to let him in on a personal level. Is she still in "we can't be any more together than we are right now" mode, or has she moved on? And now there is the Elena/Sasha bombshell to deal with. I will understand if it gives her pause, but at the same time, it is something that happened thirty years ago. Ruth herself changed dramatically in the few years she was gone - will she be able to allow for the fact that Harry is perhaps also no longer the same person he was back then?

I wonder if Ruth, and us, should rather judge him on how he handles the situation now. In this, for me, he got the first part right: he told her the truth as soon as she asked.

Let's see where they take it from here.

[harrbd]

(20-09-2011 06:22 AM)Silktie Wrote:  So, another slight reset in the tone of their relationship - after the unease of most of season 9 they are now quite comfortable and pally with each other. Should we deduce from this that they had been seeing a bit of each other while Harry was on gardening leave? But if this was so, why do they only now have the conversation about Lucas?

Series 10 Spoiler: show

I think that Harry had just got the news that they had found the body of Lucas North (the real one !). It may well have taken 8 weeks to find it. The other remark about why he had been told to meet on the roof top seemed to be a "still don't understand moment" ??

[JHyde]

What's interesting about Harry and Ruth is that I think with every year and every season they have worked together they have a better understanding of one another. I think they both know exactly who the other is, but worries that the other has no idea about who they themselves are.

[richliga]

yes they seem to be real soul mates... I hope that trust they have between each other wont break during this series...

I sooo love how they talk with their eyes and looks. Harry just must give her a look and Ruth can read what he means or thinks... and vice versa. )) And its all because of such a great acting by NW and PF... I am totally sold!

[Sparky]

As Silktie said, they seem a lot more at ease both with each other and with their relationship in general this series. I took the fact that Ruth was at the hearing in that she was there supporting him, and I don't think he denied his feelings for her there (as others have said), rather pointing out that he made the decision about Albany despite their personal relationship and not because of it. As they left the building it seemed obvious, to me at least, that they had spent quite a bit of time together in some way shape or form over the preceding 8 weeks.

It seems now that the fact that they have a 'personal relationship' (in whatever guise that is) is something that everyone is aware of and just accepts. It will be interesting to see what happens next after the 'big revalation' as I'm sure there must be more to come. I'd like to think that something that happned 30 yers ago wouldn't have such a massive impact now.

[harrbd]

I agree that Harry and Ruth may have spent a lot of time together in the past 8 weeks as they are very comfortable together. Not much sexual tension either so we can only guess where they are with their relationship. I think that they have been together so that is why Harry is so sad that all this may tear it apart again. I do wonder if, at the end, we discover that they had got married in these 8 weeks. A flash back maybe ? Hopefully not just before the "tragic ending" !

[loladom]

I thought it interesting that when Harry asked Ruth to be his plus 1 he did so without the typical hesitancy he's shown in the past. Furthermore he felt it necessary to explain it wouldn't be a fun night out and Ruth, rather tellingly I thought, replied - 'well we've had worse' So to me it was implying they have had something occur between them during the 8 weeks. It's unfeasible that Ruth wouldn't have seen Harry after she thought he had met his death in S9 and once she understood Albany was fake.

Although I wanted to see that conversation, I also understand the writers starting S10 allowing the viewers their own assumptions about how they made their peace. The important fact is that they have found some peace with each other.

I LOVED the line where R asked to see the file. Her approach was so like the Ruth of S3 and 4.

And as Silktie mentioned - he has told her his secret at the first opportunity and when she asked. He didn't lie to her about his past in that moment. She is his confidant. Very important move. I'm still hopeful.

And we see in ep 2 that Harry tells Ruth

Series 10 Spoiler: show

You're the only one I can turn to