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BoHenley · 02-04-2011, 10:37 PM

True (and I don't want to send this thread in the wrong direction but) didn't Harry assassinate the former HOME SECRETARY? I really didn't like him doing that. It just was "Not Harry," somehow...no matter how much he grieved for Ros.

Saerwen · 02-04-2011, 11:09 PM

I think Malcolm was the only one shocked that it had been 8 years that Lucas had been in captivity.
I think if I had been Lucas and come back after what he had endured I wanted to know it wasn't for nothing. I don't think Harry knew what to do with him as he could have been turned or atleast have a conversation over what happened or perhaps hidden guilt as we don't really know what went wrong to get him captured in the first place.

HellsBells · 05-04-2011, 01:33 PM

The character of Lucas had so many potentially great story lines, any of which could have been used for RA to leave the series, series 9 was just such a waste.

BravoNine · 05-04-2011, 02:13 PM

I think in both Series 7 and Series 8, there were certain moments where I do think Harry has shown a sense of protectiveness when it comes to Lucas and what he had suffered, or at least PF played it that way.

I remember that in Series 7's final episode where they are interrogating Connie, Lucas had a line that said "I spent 8 years in a Russian cell because I was loyal to my country..." and at that moment that camera cut to Harry's face and the expression he wore was one of regret and sympathy, at least that's how it looked like to me, like Harry felt sorry that Lucas had to suffer for that long.

And then in Series 8 in the episode when Darsharvain shows up, I saw quite a bit of Harry's protectiveness flaring up, even if some of that may be distrust but at least Harry's had reactions. The way that Harry and Lucas can literally stand in his office and have a big shouting match is something that is indicative of their relationship, the fact that they do have a close bond, I mean, who else has Harry really allowed to yell at him in his own office?

Series 9 just really stripped all that away, the writers didn't make anything sympathetic for John/Lucas once they decided to stuck this whole new personality on him. If it wasn't for those final moments of great acting with RA and PF on that roof, that whole scene would have been a big flop.

HellsBells · 06-04-2011, 01:48 PM

Yes 8.4 was a great episode to see Harry protecting Lucas and realizing that Lucas had been damaged by his time in Russia. That shouting match in Harry's office is a brilliant scene. And when Lucas finds out that Darshavin has Sarah his first thought is to call Harry, the one person who can get him out of the situation he can no longer handle by himself.

Byatil · 06-04-2011, 10:35 PM

Just been watching 9.5 and a couple of things jumped out at me, not really topics of much discussion but I felt the need to share them regardless Tongue

Harry recounts the quote "The greatest hazard of all, losing one’s self, can occur very quietly in the world, as if it were nothing at all.” when talking to Lucas in his office right at the end of the episode, which was (I assume) intended to be a subtle hint at the whole Lucas-is-John scenario. A nice touch, regardless.

Secondly, when Lucas goes to leave Harry's office, Harry says to him "Important work today, Lucas." The word important stood out to me - not Good work today, Lucas, but important work. Another subtle hint at Lucas-is-John's obsession with "being someone"?

Just a couple of points of interest!

BravoNine · 06-04-2011, 11:14 PM

Honestly, Harry should have just given Lucas a hug, some cookies, and have a touchy-feely-manly-talk, and this whole mess would have never happened!

I keep on saying that to Harry...but since when does he ever listen to me...and of course now this mess with John/Lucas happens....it's all his fault... Dodgy

Byatil · 06-04-2011, 11:47 PM

I think Harry going so far as to say "Important work today, Lucas" was his attempt at reaching out. Harry's office is usually a place of conflict where the two of them are involved, but this time they remain calm, and Harry praises Lucas - the timing of this is quite important. Harry makes the comment just as Lucas is leaving the room, almost as if he was debating not to say anything at all. I think the writers wanted to show Harry building a sense of trust with Lucas, only to have it completely thrown back in his face. Right at the beginning of the series, Lucas demands "Give me Section D (...) you have to trust me" (indirect paraphrasing!), and Harry almost reluctantly agrees. He obviously wants Lucas to believe that he has his trust, yet still isn't sure whether he actually does trust Lucas or not.

HellsBells · 07-04-2011, 01:50 PM

At this point in series 9 I really believed that Harry was going to find out that there was a 'problem' with Lucas and then question Lucas' loyalty to Harry/MI5. The rest of the series would then be about Lucas proving himself worthy of Harry's trust and position as section chief. I couldn't believe the way it played out, right to the end I was waiting for that twist in the story line that would redeem Lucas' character.

BAUER24 · 07-04-2011, 03:09 PM

I think thats why people are annoyed that the storyline turned out the way it did, because Harry had opportunities to find out why Lucas was acting weird. SEASON 9 SPOILERS especially when the albany was downloaded and Lucas used someone else's user id. Did Harry not find that a bit strange that someone with a clean history who wasn't a member of the frontline team was suddenly wanting a classified document.