[Spoilers] Interview with S9 writers Sam Vincent & Jonathan Brackley

[harrbd]

(07-03-2011 09:39 PM)Tea Lady Wrote:  Cultbox interview with S9 writers. They are also writing for S10. There are a couple of questions about S10, but they don't really reveal anything. Also, if anyone knows what "Berlin corners" means? Please let me know.

http://www.cultbox.co.uk/interviews/excl...-interview

There are two old films called Berlin - Schoenhauser Corner and Berlin Around the Corner. These seem to deal with the usual East against West, Spies etc but also the conflict between young and old and social problems caused by society.
Maybe they are going down this route following the Student riots in London etc?

[A Cousin]

(09-03-2011 05:29 AM)JHyde Wrote:  I just think that it didn't work with the character they chose. What they gave us is difficult to reconcile with the Lucas we had for 2 seasons prior to this turn around.

I would absolutely agree with this. Upon re-reading the article, I am not sure they had a choice of character. At the very least they had an extra challenge thrust upon them as what are in essence a couple of rather inexperienced writers, no disrespect intended. Ben Richards was inexperienced too but they didn't give the whole of a series to him. And his first episode was kind of clunky in my opinion. It seems to me that they knew from a very early stage that RA at least might be leaving. If they knew this when they were setting up the story arc, they would have known this waaaay back in late 2009 before they even started filming. They had no choice but to set the series up for both possibilities. If they did not know for certain whether or not they were going to have Lucas into S11 when they were setting up the series arc, that is quite a large question mark over S10. I am not trying to defend them or Kudos. I am just trying to say that maybe they were put in a very challenging position. They placed their bet, for some of us, myself included, it didn't pay off. Of course, one could equally argue that they had plenty of time to set it up much better than they did! lol!

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(09-03-2011 07:00 AM)Naivety Wrote:  I think we have to remember that not all viewers have watched Spooks since the beginning and may just be casual first timers. Kudos has to increase 'market share' of the viewers. The Lucas storyline didn't make sense to us dedicated fans, but to someone watching for the first time or as a stand alone series, it must have seemed good, 'high octane hokum', to quote Peter Firth.

I just hope it hasn't backfired and lost them as many loyal fans as it gained them new ones!

I also think that this is a very good point from a Business Of The Business POV. I think they knew that with RA leaving (which they seemed to be aware of very early in the process), they were going to lose a segment of their viewers no matter what. But they cannot write the show to appease any specific fan base whether it be Lucas/RA, Harry/Ruth or Fidget/Scarlet! I think that is what they were saying when they said they knew that there would be some very devoted RA/Lucas fans that would want their heads on a stick.

[HellsBells]

(09-03-2011 02:40 PM)A Cousin Wrote:  I also think that this is a very good point from a Business Of The Business POV. I think they knew that with RA leaving (which they seemed to be aware of very early in the process), they were going to lose a segment of their viewers no matter what. But they cannot write the show to appease any specific fan base whether it be Lucas/RA, Harry/Ruth or Fidget/Scarlet! I think that is what they were saying when they said they knew that there would be some very devoted RA/Lucas fans that would want their heads on a stick.

I agree that the writers can not write to appease any particular fan base, but if they had written a well thought out storyarc that would still see the demise of Lucas maybe some of those fans who were watching it solely because of RA might have stayed around for series 10.

[BoHenley]

Yes, I'm one who's not sure whether I'll watch it after the square-peg-forced-into-a-round-hole ending to S9. I'm sure I'll watch the start of S10, and if they write a plausible storyline - no problem. But if they're doing it just for shock value, then I'll forget it and watch a Stephen King film.

As for "Berlin Corners": That's an old Spooks writers' trick. Throw something ambiguous out to the fans (and forums), who'll debate what it means for the eight months or so it takes to get the series out.

[HellsBells]

Love the idea of what 'Berlin Corners' means, you could be right!

[BravoNine]

(09-03-2011 07:00 AM)Naivety Wrote:  The Lucas storyline didn't make sense to us dedicated fans, but to someone watching for the first time or as a stand alone series, it must have seemed good, 'high octane hokum', to quote Peter Firth.

(09-03-2011 07:41 AM)xRuthx Wrote:  To the person above me that's a good point. I wonder what random viewers who had never seen previous series before think of Jucas? I mean if there was no previous canon, I guess there's no reason why that storyline wouldn't work as a concept (there would still be niggling plot holes but they wouldn't feel as big).

From the reactions of people I knew whom I got them into watching Spooks, they were utterly disappointed at the sheer stupidity of this storyline.

They were not as fanatical as I am about Lucas's storyline, but they thought the execution of the storyline was just horrible. They keep on coming to me and saying that it just made no sense, that there was no proper explanation about how anything really happen as if insulting the viewer's intelligence.

My residence faculty master who is a Film and East Asian Studies professor just kept on shaking his head at how the most important and central point of the story is the weakest and one that the writers never tried or even attempted to explore, he thought it was shameful that these writers didn't even have the decency to think of a good plan other than just shock value.

Personally, I don't really care that RA was leaving or that Lucas would die, what really mattered to me was that the storyline makes sense!

I understand that writers can't please everyone, and I don't expect them to, their focus should be on the show and what the show needs, not trying to cater to every fan desire, that's fine, I get it, that doesn't upset me. But when you throw away logic to make room for just shock value, then it's stupid.

The attitude these writers presented were just smug, as if thinking that they had written the most amazing story in the world, and that is what really pisses me off. In their minds, it's like the viewers are stupid or something, and that somehow being shocking matters more than executing a storyline that makes actual sense!

I would gladly stick around to watch Series 10 even if RA/Lucas left, but now because of their stupid smug attitudes and their horrid storyline, I'm not looking forward to Series 10 at all.

I have lost faith in these writers.

[binkie]

(20-03-2011 09:50 AM)BravoNine Wrote:  

(09-03-2011 07:00 AM)Naivety Wrote:  The Lucas storyline didn't make sense to us dedicated fans, but to someone watching for the first time or as a stand alone series, it must have seemed good, 'high octane hokum', to quote Peter Firth.

(09-03-2011 07:41 AM)xRuthx Wrote:  To the person above me that's a good point. I wonder what random viewers who had never seen previous series before think of Jucas? I mean if there was no previous canon, I guess there's no reason why that storyline wouldn't work as a concept (there would still be niggling plot holes but they wouldn't feel as big).

From the reactions of people I knew whom I got them into watching Spooks, they were utterly disappointed at the sheer stupidity of this storyline.

Coincidentally, the subject of season 9 came up in conversation yesterday, and someone happened to mention it was not a show they had ever consciously seen before - their housemate was a fan, so this was their introduction to proceedings. "Some people thought the storyline was a bit undercooked," I said, trying to be neutral "Oh god!" he replied, "I was insulted and I wasn't even really watching."

[xRuthx]

^No one I know watches Spooks and series nine still hasn't aired in Oz yet so thanks for those responses about what less committed viewers thought

I do have to agree with Bravo Nine though in that I found the tone in parts of the interview to be rather insulting to some Spooks viewers (in particular the sarcastic bit about Lucas fans reaction and Harry being a cross dresser or whatever in series ten, my own response being "ah ha so you don't even take your own series nine storyline seriously. Right. Good to know. Oh and you have no respect for people remotely invested in Lucas. Good attitude." I know its all in the context though and its hard to tell how things are meant to be taken in written format but that bit just really rubbed me the wrong way) and I don't have much faith in their "shock value" approach. I'm hoping they'll lose that approach for series ten. Fingers crossed

Anyway, series ten is a new series after all. Hopefully the writers will read what worked and what didn't in the usual fan spaces and realise maybe the approach they went for wasn't the best one. I live in hope

[binkie]

(20-03-2011 11:18 AM)xRuthx Wrote:  ^No one I know watches Spooks and series nine still hasn't aired in Oz yet so thanks for those responses about what less committed viewers thought

...

Anyway, series ten is a new series after all. Hopefully the writers will read what worked and what didn't in the usual fan spaces and realise maybe the approach they went for wasn't the best one. I live in hope

Don't let the jaded misery and emotional distress of some of us ruin your anticipation for season 9!!! There are, honestly, other elements of the season that do work (very well), and are shocking, in the 'right' way, for people who have been watching forever, and for people who have never given the show a second thought.

I agree that it would be preferable if the new-ish writers could take their feet off the sensational!storylines pedal for the next season. I'd hope the attitude expressed in this interview is a sort of self justification after the fact, rather than a sign of how things are likely to go in future seasons

[xRuthx]

^Do you mean ten lol? As long as there is a Ruth in Spooks I'll be anticipating away don't you worry!

I really enjoyed the art direction, costume and makeup for series nine and I LOVED LOVED LOVED the Ruth storyline. LOVED.