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**A Cousin** · 21-07-2010, 06:32 PM

(21-07-2010 05:37 PM)Tea Lady Wrote: Is doing nothing always the best option just because you are afraid it could turn out badly? Difficult one.

Difficult indeed. The US has a very complicated relationship with Iraq due to this kind of thing dating back to the early 60's. Sometimes you may initially support the party but the depots that come after are like trying to hold a wet cat by the tail.

Doesn't Harry say that to Adam when he is voicing his concerns to Ruth about taking out the Syrian Head of Security by request of the Syrian Foreign Minister? He says something like, "Maybe doing something is better than doing nothing." Which is interesting b/c he is not inclined to think it a good idea in discussion with Juliet. Maybe he is playing devils advocate? Maybe he is rationalizing what he is being forced to do by his superiors?

lwhite53 · 21-07-2010, 10:06 PM

(21-07-2010 03:23 PM)A Cousin Wrote: Maybe I am just muddled as I so often am, but the big question in my mind is why was Farook not hanged? Clearly he was supposed to be and he wouldn't have been a friend of the Syrian government unless they didn't believe Adam's set up. Which I guess is possible, but in that case why would he be on the run? I guess he escaped?

Farook wasn't hanged (hung?) because, as it turns out, he was really a double agent for Syria. The Israelis thought they had turned him but he was reporting to Syrian intelligence all the time.

Re Silktie's question about countries interfering in the internal structures and operations of other countries -- the US has LOTS of history in this arena and, to my knowledge, it's never worked out well (think of the Shah of Iran, Saddam Hussein, Haiti, El Salvador, the Philippines, South Vietnam, a number of African and other South American countries, etc). In all cases, the US's basic motivation was to install regimes that were sympathetic to American "values" (read right wing and non-Communist), not regimes that were sympathetic to their own peoples. I do believe that democracy is the best form of government but that's only my opinion -- it doesn't mean that people and countries who don't subscribe to that view are not entitled to whatever form of govt they choose. It would be inspiring if "oppressed peoples" (my definition, of course) would arise and take back their countries but if they don't, that's their decision and their business. I (and my govt) have neither the right nor the authority to do so for them.

**A Cousin** · 23-07-2010, 03:08 AM

(21-07-2010 10:06 PM)lwhite53 Wrote: Farook wasn't hanged (hung?) because, as it turns out, he was really a double agent for Syria. The Israelis thought they had turned him but he was reporting to Syrian intelligence all the time.

Hunged? Hangified? Wink

Next thing you know I'll be making words up and equating myself to Shakespeare like that scary chick from Alaska! Dodgy

They use "hanged" in the episode but I am not sure what is correct. But I digress...

Was the double agent thing ever actually mentioned in the episode? I am not doubting that he was because I feel like it was at least implied, but I also feel like there is a hole in the writing here that I am trying to fill for myself. Clearly the Syrian government did not hang him either because they didn't believe that he was a traitor or because he went into hiding for 10 years like he said. If he actually was working for the Syrian government, why go into hiding? What else am I missing?

I clearly need to watch this again... Silba

allanah · 23-07-2010, 05:13 AM

I do believe "hung" would be correct term here.

**Kazters** · 23-07-2010, 11:11 AM

its def mentiond and implied that he was a double agent, dosent he farook say something about it, and ruth mentiones it? must remember to rewatch again (cos i need an excuse to watch spooks eps) but there are a few plot holes in this ep but dosent stop me from enjoying it! even if i do get annoyed at fiona, especialy how angry she is when adam turns up at the safe house!

lwhite53 · 23-07-2010, 03:45 PM

(23-07-2010 03:08 AM)A Cousin Wrote: Was the double agent thing ever actually mentioned in the episode? I am not doubting that he was because I feel like it was at least implied, but I also feel like there is a hole in the writing here that I am trying to fill for myself. Clearly the Syrian government did not hang him either because they didn't believe that he was a traitor or because he went into hiding for 10 years like he said. If he actually was working for the Syrian government, why go into hiding? What else am I missing?

I clearly need to watch this again...

Yeah, it was mentioned by Fiona's friend in one of their conversations and then again, by Ruth I think. He's probably been in hiding for ten years because of the Israelis -- if they knew he was alive, they'd take him out. The Syrians clearly knew he was still alive because the Foreign Minister guy said "I didn't know you were here [in the UK]" after he returned from the hospital.

**A Cousin** · 23-07-2010, 04:08 PM

Ah-ha! Its spoken once and Harry says it! Just after the voice recognition result about who Shaloub was talking to. Harry says it into the phone to Adam while he is speeding to the airport. I think I was just too involved in the visuals and the boulder careening towards Adam and Fiona to really hear it. It just sort of went in viscerally.

Another one for you, re: Farook going into hiding, Ruth does say that Farook turned out to be a Massad agent anyway. Of course they were fed that story by the Syrian Government. As you mention, the Syrian Foreign Minister clearly knows that Farook was never executed. The Syrian government must have perpetuated the story Adam framed Farook with, faked his execution and sent Farook into hiding so he could continue to... what? Work off the radar for them? I get that the Israelis might want Farook dead if they knew he was alive, but only if knew they was involved in planting the bombs in Tel Aviv for the Syrians. Other wise, why would the Israelis want a Syrian operative who was purportedly executed for working for them dead? I am so sorry to harp on this. There is just something wrong with this part of the plot and it's driving me CRAZY!!! Suicida

And as for the hang/hung/hanged issue - thanks to the Merriam-Webster dictionary, I have officially learned something new. Cool

The writers used hanged throughout the episode. The correct use in this context is indeed "hanged." This is the past tense of "hang" if used to describe an execution specifically. In all other cases, "hung" would be correct, e.g. "I hung on her every word". I still like "hangified" best! Silba

**JHyde** · 24-07-2010, 07:39 PM

Something which hasn't been mentioned yet is the scene between Fi and Jo, a really lovely vignette into Fi's past life. Both actresses play this nicely and I love that it's on the roof. (Love the roof scenes! Still curious as to why it isn't bugged...or maybe it is....) There's a believability to this scene as well - an older, more experienced operative opening up about her past and how she came to this job. Part of this history we know because of Adam in 3.1 and 3.10, but hearing it from Fiona is quite different. It's also a show of Fiona's confidence in Jo, the only one she is able to give as she later plays Jo to get away.

**Kazters** · 24-07-2010, 07:46 PM

(24-07-2010 07:39 PM)JHyde Wrote: Something which hasn't been mentioned yet is the scene between Fi and Jo, a really lovely vignette into Fi's past life. Both actresses play this nicely and I love that it's on the roof. (Love the roof scenes! Still curious as to why it isn't bugged...or maybe it is....) There's a believability to this scene as well - an older, more experienced operative opening up about her past and how she came to this job. Part of this history we know because of Adam in 3.1 and 3.10, but hearing it from Fiona is quite different. It's also a show of Fiona's confidence in Jo, the only one she is able to give as she later plays Jo to get away.

it is a lovely scene i love how jo isnt sure how much to ask or what to say other than thank you!

i love the roof scenes! i can think of two big ones with jo to!

**Silktie** · 25-07-2010, 03:56 PM

Re Fiona leaving Jo in the lobby: While I agree that she did it firstly because she wanted to get away, I think there's also an element of Fiona being concerned for Jo's life. Fiona knows what kind of man her ex is, and that he wouldn't hesitate to kill Jo to get to Fiona. So perhaps there was a little bit of altruism in her decision as well.